Yes, I am looking forward to playing the remake also. There’s a lot to like about the trailer as well.
I know I can go back and play the original even if it doesn’t turn out to be great. What I’m concerned about is that Panzer Dragoon may come to be remembered as something which doesn’t capture the essence of Panzer Dragoon, and the original games become forgotten because they weren’t widely known to begin with. Compare the situation to, say, the upcoming Lion King remake. Everyone has seen the original Lion King and it’s part of popular culture, so there’s little chance of the remake replacing it.
I’ve been telling everyone for years: this is what happens to a game series when you lose the original developers. Something is always lost. Whether it be: the look, the feel, the gameplay and most importantly, the art direction! It was bound to happen.
With no one in this new development team connected to Team Andromeda, they are going to empart their own vision on “what they think” the game should look like. So either you like it, except it for what it is, or you end up not being able to live with that change.
I’m not happy with the Art Direction either. Panzer Dragoon was the game that made me want to became a concept artist in the first place and couldn’t help but feeling disappointed when I watched the trailer.
I’m not hating or trying to provide negative feedback. I want this game to be as good as it can be, but I think you’re missing my point.
Yes, there was a lot of technical limitations at the time but I believe this level was designed this way on purpose. There are other levels in the game that are way more populated by assets than this one.
PD games are know for this specific kind of levels that are very “painterly” (for the lack of a better word) in which you see the horizon and a lot sky. This one of those levels. This not an “action” level, It’s not a dramatic level, it’s an “enjoy the ride” level. Just listen to the music.
I believe they missed that point. The way it is right now it’s not pleasant. It’s claustrophobic, I can’t see the sky, It’s packed with assets placed everywhere, the time of day is completely different and so is the mood.
The devs have plenty of levels to go crazy and I think they can look great, like the forest in Zwei for example, but sometimes less is more and this is one of those cases.
That’s an excellent breakdown of how the developers missed the artistic intent behind the first level. The impression I had is that they wanted to show of their graphics engine, but didn’t realize that it wasn’t just the limited technical capabilities that caused the area to look like it did. It was supposed to be a large body of water with only remnants of man-made buildings sticking out of the water.
All in all the first game is arguably the least important Panzer Dragoon game so I’d rather have them make mistakes now and get Zwei right. I’m curious to see the approach they took with the other areas though.
As for no other developer making this game: if anything Forever Entertainment remaking the PD games was a lot less likely than Futatsugi getting to remake the PD games. I really expected Futatsugi to get the license from SEGA much like how Yu Suzuki got the license for Shenmue 3, Tetsuya Mizuguchi got the license for Rez Infinite and (not in the least) Yukio Futatsugi’s own Grounding inc. is now working on Space Channel 5 VR. Yukio Futatsugi also sounded a bit bitter in that recent video when he said he wasn’t informed of the remakes.
A sub-par view of the series is exactly what concerns me. Sometimes it’s better to leave a legacy as it is rather than tarnish it, even if you don’t get new content.
Saying that, I was stoked to see Panzer Dragoon get some love again. I hadn’t read anything, what a surprise. I’ll likely give this a go and I’m looking forward to seeing what they do with Zwei. I have a lot of love for Zwei. Will we get a scoreboard for levels/runs similar to Nights into Dreams? That’d be great.
While the Epic exclusivity deal is no doubt a disaster, I’m surprised to see generally positive receptions from the people who played Shenmue 3 at E3. I was honestly expecting a broken, unfinished game at this point, so it’s actually looking better than I had expected.
As for being unsure Grounding Inc has what it takes: they have key members from Team Andromeda, and Futatsugi still has close connections to SEGA of Japan and other SEGA icons like Tetsuya Mizuguchi (Rez). And they already worked on a rail shooter in the form of Crimson Dragon (which would have turned out to be a better game if it hadn’t been for some unfortunate business decisions from Microsoft). Who could possibly claim to be in a better position to remake Panzer Dragoon? Meanwhile, Forever Entertainment is only really know for Fear Effect Sedna, which wasn’t exactly received well. Nobody predicted FE of all companies to get the Panzer Dragoon license, and I think it’s perfectly normal to be wary of how they’re going to handle the Panzer Dragoon franchise, especially without input from the people that actually worked on the original games.
That’s not to say it can’t turn out to be a good thing. Streets of Rage 4 is looking great in my opinion, and barely anyone had heard of the 3 companies making it. But that team is actually making levels and implementing things based on the original design documents of Streets of Rage 2. So far, Forever Entertainment doesn’t seem to have much, if any, access to basic assets (sound effects) or documentation. We don’t know how much they’re interested in the story and the world of Panzer Dragoon, or if they just want to focus on making a good railshooter. I hope they can still do both, but hearing them say that they need to alter the original level design because “players request nice and detailed backgrounds today” is rather worrying. I also found it to be a really odd thing to say when you consider that they reveal the game on the Switch, which is known for games that value artistic direction over graphical prowess. The gameplay trailer was far from achieving a constant 60fps for that matter, so it’s not like they had room to spare for the added details. And there’s the example of Panzer Dragoon Orta’s episode 5, which was somewhat of an homage to the first episode of the original game (possibly even set in the same location). They didn’t add more details even though they could have.
Anyway, long story short, I’m worried about the remakes. We still haven’t seen much, and to their credit the developers seem passionate about what they’re doing and they put a lot of work in already. I don’t want to draw conclusions this early when so much still has to be revealed. And I’m fully aware that the majority of people who’ll play the game won’t care about many of the details that worry me. But we’re relatively close to release already, so I’d rather send constructive feedback now in the hopes that they take it into account during development.
As for the future, if the remakes end up doing well, I’m all for Futatsugi working with them. I do regret that he was sidelined for this project. It’s not like they’re unable to contact him. I kind of still hope they reconsider and get him involved. If I was asked to work on a remake, I’d certainly be looking to ask input from the very people that created the franchise.
I think the new art direction is growing on me. It’s warmer, more vibrant, a bit more surreal. And I like that. I don’t think I’d be too distraught if it stayed just the way it is.
I don’t think the PD series was meant to look photorealistic. It always had sort of a hand painted, on the fringes of being subtly cell shaded, kind of aesthetic. I would have been mortified if it had an uninspired plastic looking, mainstream look.
Also, I think the first level in the remake is at dusk or sunset? So, they might have been going for a different mood regarding this level, considering how outdated the graphics are in the original.
I would have felt better if Grounding and Land Ho were handling the remake. Both studios have ex TA staff , also Long Ho did a great job with the Sega Ages version
Agreed. Sega have a bad track record for hiring the wrong companies to make remakes of their games.
As for the trailer; I understand wanting to modernise it. But why is the colour palette so fugly? Whether you’re targetting a new audience or the hardcore fans, however you look at it, the game looks drab. This isn’t want modern audiences want to see.
“Earthly” is the term I would use to describe Panzer Dragoon’s colour palette. There’s the sense from the colour palette that the games take place in a desolate world. Instead, the trailer is hyper-colourful with bloom everywhere. The orange in the dragon’s wing is almost fluorescent.
The main thing fans have been concerned about here is how it makes sense from a historical point of view. What would the city have looked like before it was sunken? Do cities normally have lots of rock formations in them? Does it even need elements added, or would an empty world that uses open space well (see Journey, Shadow of the Colossus) better convey the post apocalyptic mood?
Which is why this new team like the one that did the SOTC remake are misinterpriting Team Andromeda’s work. Bluepoint added a bunch of filler within Team ICOs world that gave the remake almost a different tone. Same thing with this PD remake.
I hate when a completely new team takes control of a beloved franchise without at least consulting the original team members.
I’ve already talked a bit about the Shadow of the Colossus remake, but for what it’s worth, I liked what they did with that remake a lot more than what I’m seeing in this trailer. Hopefully they’ll have time to fix some basic issues like the colour palette at least.
I want it to be very faithful also, but I think I am ok with some of the visual differences as long as gameplay and story is consistent. It is exciting as I feel it is going to be good for the community. New players joining us and hopefully leading to more visibility for the series.
On a side note, it would be really great if they included an emulated version of the originals with each of the new versions as part of the release. Saturn emulation has come a long way and is very accurate these days. Including the classic version would be a good way for satisfying original fans/purists.
I one up that frelled. Actually, the higher rez PS2 re-release, or the PC version of the original might be better. Even on the smaller Switch screen, the first game would seem a blocky mess.
I need to mention that my previous post was too negative. In spite of what I said, Im still excited to play this remake. As long as they dont completely mess up the controls, it should be a fun ride.
I do, however, already really, REALLY hope they include the original soundtrack. I can’t play the rereleased Onimusha or Spyro titles because they composed new music.
Finally, there needs to be more than the standard arcade mode in this re-release. I’m not precisely sure what they ought to include as well, other than a level select, but there needs to be some extra modes to up the longevity of the title. Perhaps some bonus side missions where they reuse the levels, but taking different routes, different enemy layouts, etc.
I agree, it does need some kind of new mode. We’re all going to beat this in one play session. It’ll only take a few hours…So, maybe include a mode in which we unlock things for Pandora’s Box? Having to get certain high scores, or completing certain extra objectives.
Or have an extra level where we do said objectives in a new unique way. They could take inspiration from Moebius’ artwork and craft a unique level…
It would also be cool if this game or in Zwei remake, they have a hub village you can walk around in. Where in-between levels we can talk to inhabitants and apply certain attributes to our dragon. Sort of like “very light” rpg elements. That would be awesome! And it would give it that Panzer Dragoon Saga feel.
