Interestingly enough, I’ve just gone and checked out those bibles again, and as far as I can tell this is not what they are describing…
The “gods” that the bible discusses don’t seem to fit the description for the “Ancients” so well at all. In fact, it is the humans in the Book of Genesis that appear to be the Anceints; it was these humans that waged war upon one another and eventually ruined the Earth. The gods were an outside force that gave the humans these powers, which would actually fit in with my previous point.
If these bibles are any reflection on the truth, then the Anceints may very well have believed that their powers over the creation of life were god-given. What I said before - about the scientists remarking that the Light Wing could have been a divine gift - would make even more sense in light of this.
In that bible, the gods gave the Ancients their powers to create. The gods were just gods, however real or unreal they may have been. The Ancients were the normal people of the world, as far as I can tell.
Or maybe, according to my theory as written in my previous posts, that one group are the “Gods” and they WOULD eventually return if Abadd’s mission was succesful and the rest ancients, their followers, believed they owe everything to that one group including those “powers” (technology basically to us) same as for example (yeah I know I talk about them too much but it’s the only good example I can think of atm) the Egyptians believed they owe everything to their Pharaos(sp), even the prosperity of the land for example… It matches good enough here too imo I don’t see why it has to be dismissed as wrong so fast, snif
Oops, my mistake. I’m still used to calling the specific group of people Abadd was supposed to resurrect (the people who built the Towers) the Ancients, when in fact all the citizens of the Ancient Age were the Ancients.
The gods were Abadd’s masters who thought they were wiser than the warring humans of the planet, so decided to wipe out most of humanity and rebuild the world for themselves. They may have thought they were more enlightened than the different factions (of humans) who waged war in the Ancient Age, but in the end they were nothing more than brutal killers.
Actually, that’s an interesting way of looking at things. To be honest, I’ve never really thought of Abadd’s masters as being any different from the other Ancients. I just imagined that those individuals were smart enough to go into hibernation to escape the wars that were consuming the planet. Of course they intended to reawaken one day when the destruction was over and the world was renewed… but I’ve never considered that those specific Ancients destroyed the world “on purpose”. I thought they just went into hibernation to escape the endless fighting and destruction, so that they could survive.
What is it that makes you think those particular Ancients actively destroyed the world? I mean, rather than the impression I got, which was that they simply observed the world being destroyed by the endless wars, and went into hibernation to save themsleves?
[quote=“Al3xand3r”]Except the Ancients created Sestren as well D-Unit…
I still think those scientists were answering to some higher authority since they were told to cancel the Light Wing project (even tho they disobeyed that) and that this higher authority was what they thought of as “Gods” and they were the same as Abadd’s Masters, the Ancients destined to live again and rule the PD world once more should Abadd have succeded in his mission… Were they Gods for real? Imo No they weren’t but they sure were fond of that idea and tried to convince everyone else of that “fact” too…
Similar to how Egypt’s Pharaohs(sp) and Rome’s Caesars(sp) wanted to be worshipped as Gods by their ppl even tho as we know they were “mere” humans as well…[/quote]
I’m not so sure the Ancients really created Sestren, or just become aware of its existence, and used it to their advantage. Although I have more or less the same idea as you, I don’t think the Institute was the gods the scientists referred to. In fact, I think the Institute obeyed the gods by cancelling the Light Wing project.
I think the distinction between humans and Gods in the Zoah bibles is the key point here. Although these gods were also Ancients, they may have been different enough from the human Ancients inhabiting the planet to call them “gods”. That’s why humanity was blamed for the destruction of the planet: the gods were not a part of humanity anymore. I definitely think it was these “gods” that ended the Ancient Age (the dragons, the messengers of the gods, shut down the ruins) on purpose.
Well someone built Sestren and the Towers with the intention of restoring the planet’s desolate environment while removing humanity from the equation so as to ensure the plan came to fruition (the Towers’ creators wouldn’t want human beings raping the world of its natural resources as it was being restored). Whoever programmed Sestren to unleash bio-weapons on the ancient civilisation didn’t want to kill themselves (though for a long time before Panzer Dragoon Orta came out, many of us in the community thought along those lines because we didn’t know anyone from the Ancient Age had survived, let alone hibernated).
The Dark Dragon and its drone obeyed the will of Sestren with such dependence on their creators that they remind me of Abadd (and vice versa). Drones were built to do the Ancient’s dirty work, which would make them the perfect minions to protect your legacy while you slept.
Let’s assume that the ancients were humans. Humans are superstitious beings. A godless society never existed so we can assume that part of the ancients worshipped some kind of gods.
They thought (well, at least the guy who recorded that message) that the Light Wing was so perfect that it should be a creation worthy of the gods themselves. Its messenger.
The scientists working at LW project were Ancients. No one else had tech to make Dragons. (still assuming the ancients were physical human beings)
We don’t know if the Ancients were the only civilization to live on Earth (or somewhere else if you think PD world is not Earth) at that time. Maybe the ‘modern’ humans from the game were the remains of ancient’s civilization which was completely destroyed.
I don’t know why the Ancients made all that fuss about the Light Wing project
The LW dragon is OK but everyone knows that Solo Wing rules!
[quote=“SegaTecToy”]5) I don’t know why the Ancients made all that fuss about the Light Wing project
The LW dragon is OK but everyone knows that Solo Wing rules! :D[/quote]
I’m not sure why the Light Wing is a being that is “far different” from a normal dragon, but I do have a theory about this. The drone report stated this about the thought organs of the high-end drones:
“Plans to utilize these thought organs for monsters are underway.”
Perhaps the Light Wing was a dragon that had these thought organs. Imagine a creature with the same level of intelligence as Azel and Abadd together with the destructive force of the dragon. This would explain why the scientists were so surprised by their own creation. It would make sense that the project was cancelled because, like the high-end drones, this being could have developed its own identity and choose not to follow the Will of the Ancients.
[quote=“Geoffrey Duke”]Well someone built Sestren and the Towers with the intention of restoring the planet’s desolate environment while removing humanity from the equation so as to ensure the plan came to fruition (the Towers’ creators wouldn’t want human beings raping the world of its natural resources as it was being restored). Whoever programmed Sestren to unleash bio-weapons on the ancient civilisation didn’t want to kill themselves (though for a long time before Panzer Dragoon Orta came out, many of us in the community thought along those lines because we didn’t know anyone from the Ancient Age had survived, let alone hibernated).
The Dark Dragon and its drone obeyed the will of Sestren with such dependence on their creators that they remind me of Abadd (and vice versa). Drones were built to do the Ancient’s dirty work, which would make them the perfect minions to protect your legacy while you slept.[/quote]
Ah, I see where you’re coming from now. I still suspect that the devastation of the world / its civilisations can just be attributed to the ancient wars, though. The world only needed rebuilding because it had been devastated by war, after all, and those Ancients who built the Towers apparently just wanted to repair this global damage. Having the Towers keep control over civilisations as well as ecosystems seemed to simply aid this goal.
However, when that faction of Ancients built the Towers, they clearly didn’t give a damn about the peoples that would have to live in that world in the thousands of years in the meantime. They wanted to restore the world at any cost, and the lives of those that would come after them were clearly considered negligible as long as the planet was saved.
So I don’t think there’s enough evidence to say that those Anceints wiped out the other ancient civilisations “on purpose”. That could have happened, but I think it’s equally likely that the wars themselves did that, and these Ancients just wanted to save the dying world at any cost. While ensuring safety for themselves, of course.
[quote=“GehnTheBerserker”]This makes me wonder.Would the Light Wing look like we have envisioned him? (the Light Wing we see in Saga)
I mean, he was supposed to be a dragon of his own.The one we see is a fusion of two dragons dna (or smoethin like that).[/quote]
As far as I can tell, the D Units were just meant to contain a description of the Light Wing’s genetic code. When all of the D Units were reassembled, Lagi just changed his own genetic code into the Light Wing’s.
(In fact, the Heresy Program probably did it for him, because it was meant to be responsible for Lagi’s previous “evolutions”.)
So I expect the old Light Wing would look just like we see him.
I dunno if this thought has come out but ok
Look at drones. I dont mean Abadd, more like Azel
She was made by the Ancients AND she looks like a human.
same body shape and same face as a human,
Odviously the drones would be modeled on the Ancients them selves.
I mean it would be to much of a coincidence if they just made up a random
type look for the drones and it just happened to look human…
But if they had slaves… They whats the point in haveing drones…
The point is there has been no talk of Slaves other then Drones
So unless there is we have no need to think there was.
Then the Ancients were wiped out… but then… Id say that the humans
that live now are desendents of the Ancients,
A final few that werent wiped out kinda thing.
It fits much better if they are humans…
Pluss the japanese version said they were Humans.
The current human survivors are implied to be the living descendents of the Ancients (the Empire believes in restoring humanity’s former power for a reason), but who or what Abadd’s masters were, should be the real focus of our attention.
Drones were built to be unquestioning slaves, because generally speaking, human beings would sooner die than give up their freedom.
I think Abadd’s masters, or the gods of the Panzer world were somehow more evolved than the rest of the population. Like D-Unit, I believe they were a bunch of white orbs who stored themselves in Sestren and that’s why they leaned so heavily on their creations for support.
Edit: That was a joke btw.
Perhaps Abadd’s masters thought they were more enlightened than everyone else. Their advanced technology certainly justifies their arrogance, but they must’ve been corporeal, at least before they stored their minds in Sestren. >:)
[quote=“sharky”]But if they had slaves… They whats the point in haveing drones…
The point is there has been no talk of Slaves other then Drones
So unless there is we have no need to think there was.
Then the Ancients were wiped out… but then… Id say that the humans
that live now are desendents of the Ancients,
A final few that werent wiped out kinda thing.
It fits much better if they are humans…
Pluss the japanese version said they were Humans.[/quote]
As far as I’m aware, the Japanese version did not say that they were humans; this was just something added to the English games on transation. Most people agree that it would make more sense if the Ancients were human though, as this explains exactly the kind of points you’ve raised - like why Drones look like humans, and where the present human race came from.
The Ancients’ “unconfirmed” identity is just something it’s worth keeping in mind, in case Panzer Dragoon Orta 2 reveals that the Ancients were luminescent space badgers from mars, or something
The information contained in Panzer Dragoon Orta gives us the correct description of the Ancients as if the creators wanted to set the record straight.
I personally hope their identity remains lost with time, although I wouldn’t mind seeing a few more white orbs floating around.
