Okay, I realize that the Heresy Program leaving Lagi at the end of Saga left him as just another dragon, susceptible to death. However, he survieves the Dragonmare self destructing right in front of him. He survives the fall, as well. Now, after defeating Abadd, the dragon just…dies. He doesn’t get hurt from the battle. He was just exausted. But that’s the thing. If he’s strong enough to survive an explosinon and a fall of a few hundred feet, how come he died?
Very good question. I always wondered about that as well. The only thing that seems to be possible that I can see is he just totally over worked himself fighting Abadd but still seems rather odd to me.
Exhaustion, old age, newfound mortality, heavy injuries, plot.
Haven’t you realized yet (no pun intended :] ) that the dragon exhausts himself after a big battle?He did so when he fought Protype D in PD1,he did so when he fought Guardian D in PD2,he did so after fighting Sestren in PDS and he also did it in Orta.
Just read my Sig, it’s that simple really 
yeah i’ve never played Orta… but i never really liked the direction the storyline was heading in
WTF Scott?!
How could you say that? The storyline to the panzer dragoon series is absolutely the best out there - there is, honestly, not one game out there that can compare to it. Panzer Dragoon Saga will, forever, be the greatest game ever created.
Orta’s story, on the other hand, has very little to be desired. Regardless of the shortcominings, however, the Panzer Encyclopedia on the game is EXCELLENT and is quite deep.
To be honest, though, I was quite disappointed where they took Orta - she wasn’t a character that was very fleshed out like her predecessors, and it was very hard to even like her. Add in the fact that the designers decided to keep the Tower Network out of the storyline was a MAJOR turn-off for me. With those problems aside, however, Orta is almost untouchable gameplay wise – gameplay wise, Orta is right up there with Zwei, imo.
I think he was just talking about ORTA mate, and not any of the other Dragoon game. The only puzzling part is, if you never played ORTA how do you know what the story is like .
Also this knocking ORTA story is just so over the top .You simply cannot compare a 4 disc RPG?s to a simply 3D shooter .
I feel a bit sorry for the Team as if this had came out before SAGA, nothing woukld be said. Everybody seems to hate it, becasue they’re expecting into be SAGA II
Well, damnit, how could we not have expected a PDS II? How can anyone go from a S-ranked title like PDS, and expect to like a rather average title like PDO without complaining? That’s unrealistic, and Sega should have known better.
It seems the only people who truly like PDO, are those who never played PDS. That’s a sad, but very true, observation – the world is cruel.
I like Orta a lot, and I played Saga first too. You simply cannot expect the same level of character development in a shmup as you can in an RPG. They’re completely differing game genres and they both do what they set out to achieve very well.
[quote=“Kadamose”]Well, damnit, how could we not have expected a PDS II? How can anyone go from a S-ranked title like PDS, and expect to like a rather average title like PDO without complaining? That’s unrealistic, and Sega should have known better.
It seems the only people who truly like PDO, are those who never played PDS. That’s a sad, but very true, observation – the world is cruel.[/quote]
Get Real! . I was playing Pazner Dragoon before most people had even layed eye’s on Saturn inthe West , I’ve played every once since .
If you think I’ve never played or still don’t have a copy of SAGA you’re living on planet Mars .
ORTA is not a RPG so please don’t ever compare it to SAGA.
I’ll tell you this much , the people that rave about SAGA are the jonny come laters to the series . ORTA is more faithfull to the series than SAGA will ever be. The series a 3D shooter at heart, not a RPG.
[quote=“Team Andromeda”]
Get Real! . I was playing Pazner Dragoon before most people had even layed eye’s on Saturn inthe West , I’ve played every once since .
If you think I’ve never played or still don’t have a copy of SAGA you’re living on planet Mars .
ORTA is not a RPG so please don’t ever compare it to SAGA.
I’ll tell you this much , the people that rave about SAGA are the jonny come laters to the series . ORTA is more faithfull to the series than SAGA will ever be. The series a 3D shooter at heart, not a RPG.[/quote]
I wasn’t refering to you, if that’s what you are suggesting. I’m talking about the MAJORITY of the people who have played Orta, and never even touched the Saturn trilogy.
And though it might be true that Panzer Dragoon was originally a well-thought-out rail shooter, the series EVOLVED into something much greater. I remember back in 1998 when people were scoffing at the fact that Azel was going to be an RPG instead of a rail shooter, and they all swore that it would fail because the idea of mixing a shooter with RPG elements was absurd and could never work. I find it ironic how Team Andromeda not only succeeded in mixing those elements together FLAWLESSLY but also created the greatest RPG ever created (and that’s not open to debate either). Though Ein and Zwei were fantastic games, it was Azel that opened the door to the Panzer Dragoon world, and is a true testament to what Team Andromeda had in mind when they first envisioned the series.
With the release of Orta, however, the series was no longer evolving; instead, it regressed. So, which do you prefer? The cocoon? Or the beautiful butterfly?
Of course that isn’t open to debate! None of us would even dream of thinking any other RPG is better than Saga!
You see Saga as an evolution, when I consider it to be an anomaly. A very good one, but definitely apart from the rest of the series (naturally).
The majority of people who drop “I’ve got PDS, and it’s teh bestes EVA!” into every possible message board post are those who picked it up to prove how incredibly game-savvy and hardcore they are
Oh sorry for going a bit over the top . I happy with any new Pazner Game and love to see a ORTA II (shooter are my fav genre after all).
Of course the series is evolving. To mix inthe SAGA boss battle and morphing system in a real time shooter was nothing but a Stroke of genius and took 3D shooters to another lever . But by your logic unless SAGA II is some sort of new take on the series (say a RTS) then SAGA II won?t evolve, and will just be another RPG.
At the end of the days as long as the game is good and made because the Team want to make the game. I couldn?t care less what the next Dragoon game is.
Maybe you took my post in the wrong way…
I havn’t played Orta (don’t own an xbox). I was not commenting on the actual gameplay (as someone said - cos i havn’t played it), and of course - the storyline of the Panzer series is amazing.
Its more like Kadamose said
[quote=“Kadamose”]
To be honest, though, I was quite disappointed where they took Orta - she wasn’t a character that was very fleshed out like her predecessors, and it was very hard to even like her.[/quote]
and KFC
Throughout the Panzer series we had such amazing characters and emotional links throughout, i know I havn’t played Orta, but from reading about it ever since its release, to me it just doesn’t seem to give out that passion the other games did (even before i played them as well)
Maybe my viewpoint will change if I play it? I dunno - of course I’d like to hear your thoughts on it…
It won’t change, and if you buy an Xbox just to play Orta you’ll be left very disapointed. Sure the encyclopedia and other Pandora Box goodies are awesome but that’s not what you buy the game for… And as a game, imo, it’s lacking.
It is tougher than PDZwei by far (at the appropriate difficulty settings) but it’s nowhere near as enjoyable. I played through the main game once, it was fun, but I haven’t been wishing to go back again. You’ll be more into it as a challenging rail shooter rather than a great PD game. Myself, I just couldn’t really get into it either way.
With PDZwei, anyone may argue that the story etc wasn’t as developed as in Orta, but that doesn’t matter as the gameplay, the “feel” of gliding through the levels, and the way the story was presented was far superior to Orta and made every time almost as good as the first time.
Anyone acting like it’s stupid for people to compare the game to Saga, thus naturaly dislike it, is making a stupid assumption on first place. Orta isn’t lacking compared to Saga, it is lacking compared to PDZwei. Saga or no Saga, Orta isn’t the continuation I, and others, had hoped for.
I agree with Al3x on that last paragraph.To me tho the only difference between Orta and the previous shooters in terms of quality is the artwork (music and actual concept art).Gameplay is great the story is nice too in a PDrailshooter kind of way,you get to hear everything in Panzerense you get to see some cool locations and it’s really a mandatory purchase for a PD fan,damn you Scott!
Kadamose:
<-- that’s what you want to think but I think that is far from true.
There is certainly one aspect in the series that always evolved which was the complexity of the world.But you people like to delve on matters with no answer.Is PD a shooter series?Is Saga the whole point of the series?Is Orta non-PD?
All questions beg for an answer but there are no answers.In my soul tho the one change I wasn’t happy to see (i didn’t mind when i heard Saga was an RPG) was the art in Orta.But I a can’t say they were untrue to PD…they were untrue to MY idea of PD tho…
That?s your view and while you?re more than entitled to it, I don?t share it.
For me ORTA is the best game on the X-Box , and more than enough reason to get a X-Box . I loved every second of it .
[quote]With PDZwei, anyone may argue that the story etc wasn’t as developed as in Orta, but that doesn’t matter as the gameplay, the “feel” of gliding through the levels, and the way the story was presented was far superior to Orta and made every time almost as good as the first time.
Anyone acting like it’s stupid for people to compare the game to Saga, thus naturaly dislike it, is making a stupid assumption on first place. Orta isn’t lacking compared to Saga, it is lacking compared to PDZwei. Saga or no Saga, Orta isn’t the continuation I, and others, had hoped for.[/quote]
Again I just don’t agree flying around Ep 2 and 3 in ORTA were just as good as any seen in Zwei. The story was told better, the bosses better , and the challenge better .
Its contained all The Panzer Trademarks for me. The amazing Water effects (For me the real trademark) and music score that 's been there since the start , The stunning and weird bosses from the 1st game, The morphing, Battle systems from Saga , the on foot parts from Zwei . All in one super package .
And you can?t compare SAGA to others . Its like compare Mario RPG to Mario 64 and moaning that it doesn?t follow on . Even though it takes place in the same world with the same characters, they are totally diff genres
well in my opinion PD, PDZ and PDO are a totally different brand from PDZ, that’s why it’s called “XYZ: panzer dragoon RPG”
well I played the first PD (and for the last time plz don’t call it “Ein” that’s just wrong! it sounds like the “a” in “a car” or “a bread”, the ordinal number is “EINS”!!) and was totaly stunned because of the presentation. I played zwei and was stunned. I just wanted to see more of the world that already hinted so much complexity, PDS just fulfilled that need prefectly.
SEGA made PDO in the way it is for obvious reasons, but as with the Final Fantasy movie they played it too safe imho. the FF movie IS a milestone in full CG movie wether it was economically successful or not. but the story is just lame and way too uninspired, you can feel how the producers tried to play as safe as possible. I feel the same for Orta, I know the story writer of PDO had some very wierd ideas and was probably not the best choice for that game… it’s obvios that he has a favour for lolita and bondage themes as well.
as with the FF movie i just felt betrayed, not taken seriously. after the first euphory of seeing my name in the credits I just thought “wha? and that’s it? just that??” well some people I know claim that it’s very hard to make an epic “you got to save the world” story after such an epic ending as in PDS, and the only way to deal with it is to make a story that’s on a very personal level…but who can really identfy with Orta, in what way is that character personal or has any personality?? And btw, they could have set PDO in the ancient age, had total creative and artistic freedom… and the fall of the ancient civilisation, how epic is that?
another fact is that a lot of influetnial designers who created the saturn series had left the team when TA disbanded and the remaining designers probably had no idea what the original PD story and things like the skyrider was about. trust me, I’ve worked in a japanese game company for one year and I was never realy told what the story of the game I was working on was like… just to figure out that noone had thought of a story before! and the last PD game was made almost a decade ago. I heard that this is very comon in game develpment, not only in japan, first make a game that has this and that cool feature… and then later add a story. Orta might be a good shooter, but it is not (as) briliant (as the Saturn titles). Anyone who claims Orta was brilliant or a milestone of gaming history is out of his mind, sorry. and after all the brilliant saturn games I expected a brilliant game and was disapointed.