Twitter campaign for a new Panzer Dragoon game


#41

Ah ah regarding Assassin Creed, I played all games, even though my interest decreased a bit lately. What I liked in those games is the variety of environments you explore in each different game. I loved the “faith jump” from first game. I thought it was so cool. But yes the game was repetitive.
I am still looking forward to play the Origins game coming end of this month.

But what I don’t like much & will agree with you about is the way the world is built in those games. Same issue for me in Far Cry games.

The map is divided in areas with usually a tower that you need to climb to uncover the map. Then you get all the sub missions as dots/checkpoints on the map. This is what I HATE. Feels obvious & boring.
I also hate overcharged interfaces.
One of the aspects I loved in the Uncharted series is you have nothing on screen. Also I will play Xenoblade Chronicles 2 (my first time in the series) because it is on Switch & the hype is high but I don’t like the interface I see: too many icons, too much text.
I hate when I am told I need to go there. All this feels boring.
I want exploration & it feels right for Panzer Dragoon.

This is something they did pretty well in Zelda BotW. Even though, they also fell in the “tower to uncover the map” trap. It was ok.

It is funny because in Panzer Dragoon story, we naturally have “towers” :joy:
But ideally, I wouldn’t want a world divided on theoretical areas. I don’t want dots on map. I want the minimum, for instance the dot appears once you have reached some progression as a little assistance & but I prefer to explore as much as possible. Maybe a small open world would be ok, not divided in areas at all. Just the feeling of free movement is important for me. I feel claustrophobic in a rail shooter.

What I loved in Saga was that you could explore Zoa and talk to NPCs but there was no indication on a map.
I could spend so much time making sure I explore every corner of the city, just to be sure I didn’t miss a door.
I tried different hours of the day to see if a door wouldn’t unlock. I am sure you did the same.
We need this feeling back.

One thing great in Uncharted, especially the 4th, is the presence of striking sequences: like this motorbike pursuit, or also this scene in Madagascar when you just had an intense discussion with your wife and all sounds stops, music starts. These moment felt epic & cinematic.
It would benefit to Panzer Dragoon, especially when Saga already started this somehow.

Now, one of the major aspect of any new Panzer Dragoon would be the battle system:

  • is it going to be a rail shooter ?
  • is it going to be another turn base combat system ? the more I think about it, the more I think it wouldn’t bother me. I liked it in Saga & many games have polished this system since. It is still used in I am Setsuna, Lost Sphear, probably in other games but I am not an expert, I just know these because they are on Switch.
  • is it going to be a live action based combat system ? How would that work with the dragon ? not sure but nothing’s impossible

That takes me to share this with you:

Ryan Payton (who follows the twitter of the campaign) just shared via his studio Camouflaj that he interviewed Akihiko Mukaiyama, Director of Panzer Dragoon Orta & responsible of the battle system on Panzer Dragoon Saga.

One of the things I learnt from this is that they decided to make this game because someone told them: the series might be dead for good if you don’t do it. But they didn’t have a clear vision of what they were doing from the start.

If we ever come to have a new Panzer Dragoon, I think it is important to be clear on what you are doing. I know it is not always easy and you have new ideas along the journey. But it is important for team cohesion (in the interview, we learn they suffered from that on Orta) and for the public too if they decide to crowdfund. See how they struggle with The Good Life ? I think this also due to the fact they were completely obscure & messy when they started the campaign.


#42

This tweet got quite successful thanks to SegaWhisperer & Swery who retweeted it.
EDIT: maybe the #NintendoSwitch helped, I’m not sure exactly…
Also I had this idea for a long time but lacked the skills to merge a GIF & a still image. A fan helped on that.

I am not in the console war at all but I think this image is powerful as it shows an old game on a new console hence it summarizes what we all want: more Panzer Dragoon may it be remasters or a new game.


#43

#44

Could we “pin” the news of this campaign on the website, for instance somewhere on the right ? Because it is getting slowly buried ^^


#45

Pinned on the right? I’m not sure that it should necessarily be prioritised over other content. Everyone deserves the opportunity for their news entry to be first on the front page. Maybe we can do another update at some point though.


#46

The idea was not really to be prioritized over anybody’s content but that’s ok.


#47

I think he meant make a separate frame on the right, apart from the main “news” frame, on the front page. So, the regular news could still appear as normal, while you’d have an additional smaller frame to the right, with the campaign news…

If that’s even possible to add or integrate that into the design of the site, without taking away from the flow of the frames that are all ready there. I don’t know.

It might be nice as an experiment to try it out and see how it looks. With your site being one of the more popular PD sites and one of the last on the Internet, it might be nice means to keep the memory of his campaign burning! I guess it’s up to you Solo if you want to try to integrate that into the main page, in a separate frame.


#48

It’s always possible to alter the design. My concern is more the “why” rather than the “how”. Panzer Dragoon Legacy’s current layout was carefully designed not to priortise or promote any particular content besides the latest update since the site about Panzer Dragoon as a whole (past and future).


#49

I guess the “Why” would be so more PD fans would be exposed to the PD revival petition, if they saw and accessed it through PD Legacy?

Maybe you could make a simple link or icon that says " Panzer Dragoon Revival Petition" or something along those lines and put it below the “Facebook”, “Twitter”, “Youtube”, and “Steam”, icons? Then there would be no need for a obtrusive or cumbersome, extra frame.

If the petition fizzles out over time, you could always remove it…


#50

We have a permanent link to the petition under “Partner Sites” in the left navigation. So that’s some exposure that doesn’t disappear from the front page already, although I’m guessing that this is not perceived as sufficient. Perhaps the name should be changed so that it’s obviously a petition. “Panzer Dragoon World” sounds like it could be general Panzer Dragoon fan site. With the last petition’s name, Panzer Dragoon Revival, the purpose was clearer. Maybe “Panzer Dragoon World Petition” or “Panzer Dragoon World Campaign”?


#51

Changing the name would definitely work out better. It does sound like a regular website. I think you should just call it “Panzer Dragoon Revival Petition” again. As that’s very clear as to what it is.

What do you think Eliot-Ness?


#52

I just want to make one thing clear: I am not running this campaign to gain any personal benefit. I do not advertise for my personal drawings etc… In fact, it’s probably the opposite as it takes me quite a lot of time.

My suggestion was just to make sure this campaign is known by all fans of the series. Otherwise, how could we make any conclusion about it being efficient…

I have no problem with this name “Panzer Dragoon Revival Petition” since it is also an effort to revive the series, but simply in a different form. And as stated in my text, I also support the previous petition so they are complementary I’d say.

So you decide.

It has now been 3 months and the campaign is doing good I think with no or little help from media. But that might look ridiculous (400 followers / 250 signatures) from outside of this campaign. ie from a SEGA perspective so I have decided to consider other ways of progression.
As already proposed to me, there is the option of “follow back” or “follow for follow” which is something that was used in the ShenMue3 campaign. Hence, I started a poll on Twitter, I let fans decide:
Should I start the follow for follow/ follow back approach,
Should I keep targeting Panzer Dragoon fans only.

You can vote here (poll opened for the week end)


#53

Understood. You (and others) want to play an open world Panzer Dragoon RPG, and promoting this campaign represents what this particular segment of Panzer Dragoon fans are interested in.

As this topic as shown, not everyone wants this. Some people want a new shooter, or a linear RPG.

People come to this site for different reasons. To view new art, read news, browse the archive, etc. Or perhaps they have never played the games and want to find out what Panzer Dragoon all about with no previous knowledge (we don’t cover this last case very well to be honest). I try to balance the different things people want out of a Panzer Dragoon site as evenly as possible by keeping most of the content hidden away in logical categories, with the content on the front page primarily representing new content.

I’d be happy to publish another update about the campaign when there’s some news to report.

Regarding calling the campaign Panzer Dragoon Revival Petition, you should probably check with @Draikin about that.


#54

I would temper what you said: yes the primary idea is an open world RPG, as it’s what comes to my my mind first as a spiritual successor to SAGA, if a new game was made in 2017 or later. And I have formalized that in the text. For those who have actually read it, it is much more opened than the title could make you think. The text focuses more on the strengths of the series, rather than on the actual form of the new game.

So it turns out the whole campaign is now a lot more opened and I also campaign for remasters on the Twitter which means… everybody benefits from that. Wether you prefer rail shooter or RPGs. As I said, open world seems ideal but I’d take a linear RPG, and the petition is consistent with that.

I am trying to unite the community, there is no need to divide people in categories here. I mean I’d not even have started if I had found an active campaign. This campaign tries to give more exposure to the whole series, to gather the fans and try to show SEGA there are things they could do to break this circle of a niche series of games. Panzer Dragoon has all it needs to succeed.

So when people visit your website, I have no doubt they would be interested in knowing there is currently a campaign being run.


#55

Yes I agree, visitors will be interested. Making the petition’s title clearer (under “Partner Sites”) would be good way to let people know that there’s a petition running and less disruptive than some of the other suggestions so far.


#56

I am a little confused by these statements. The Panzer Dragoon Revival petition still has new signatures as of October 2017. It contains over 1500 signatures. A lot of work went into making translations for that campaign too (seven languages). So if the goal really is to unite the community with a general (non-specific) revival campaign, why are we starting over with new campaign rather than fans coordinating on this? That’s a question for @Draikin as well. Maybe combine them.


#57

In introduction on the change.org petition, I’ve put a link to the revival petition so I’m pretty sure some new signatures keep coming from here :wink:

I’m more than happy to promote the revival petition too, as said, I just think the two things are complementary.

Now I’m a little surprised these advices are coming now, 3 months in the campaign, when we are talking about mentioning this campaign on the website ?


#58

These petitions are not something that I am primarily focused on, and I haven’t been following your petition on Twitter to know that you’ve also been promoting it as a non-specific petition, nor read the details of the change.org text in a while. My focus is on Panzer Dragoon Legacy. I trust that other members of the community can collaborate here without my advice.


#59

For my thoughts on the matter:

I started Panzer Dragoon Revival back when I didn’t understand what it really takes to revive the Panzer Dragoon series, and when I still thought a revival was needed to begin with. I’ve become a lot more cynical over the years. For some reason, people still think the current SEGA is still representative of the old SEGA. It’s not. It’s an entirely different company that has absolutely nothing to do with the one we knew. I kept the petition online because that’s the best I can do at the moment, hoping I would find an opportunity to use it effectively. I realize I disappointed people by not doing more with the petition (not in the least @Solo_Wing), but it nonetheless remained a place for people to write about why they wanted the franchise revived. That hasn’t changed, and if I did one thing right, it was asking people to write a message with their signature. In my view, those messages hold more value than the number of signatures. Writing this, I realized I should just tweet the link to Futatsugi. I imagine it would be of more use to him now than ever before, judging from his recent interviews.

That said, I don’t really see a way to combine @Eliot-Ness’s campaign and Panzer Dragoon Revival. Eliot appears to focus on promoting a PD game (more specifically an RPG) on the Switch, and runs his campaign in a way that differs from how I would (and I don’t mean that in a bad way). Nonetheless, if I’m going to do something with PD Revival, it would seem now is a good time. First of all, I’ll send Futatsugi a link, and then think about this some more. Meanwhile, I’m open to suggestions.


#60

Wrong.
No offense, but did you read the petition ?
I said in the petition that it would be great to have a new game on all consoles but also on the Switch. The idea here was that of course this console has great benefits, but also & mainly that “rough” power should not be the key to a new Panzer Dragoon: artistic direction matters more than ultra detailed graphics. I run a poll on Twitter and others agree on that even though this is just an opinion. And we’ve seen that a console like the Switch is powerful enough to run open worlds with a beautiful artistic direction.
Also those GIFs help going viral faster. Imagine if we had to fit in a GIF a PS4/Xbox/PC + Screen + Controller, do you think the image would be as powerful ? I doubt it.
Those GIFs also help getting the attention from younger generation who have never heard of or seen Panzer Dragoon & might wonder, when seeing this, what is this game ? It looks fun !
And again, the Switch is an awesome platform for retro gaming so remasters on that would have so many chances to sell a lot. As said, I have a PS4 & gaming PC but the market on consoles & PC is so congestionned with so many games. Of course, all platform should have a new Panzer Dragoon, but I am convinced it could really shine on the Switch because the platform is still young and there are not as many games (even if it is changing quickly now). So even if a new game was released in 2 years, announcing remasters/ports or even a new game now would buzz very fast on this console because it is the platform everybody talks about at the moment. Again, don’t get me wrong, I love my PS4 Pro but I think SEGA would hold a strong hand if they had plans for this platform too in the near future. Playing arcade titles on the go like the rail shooters Panzer Dragoon games is a real plus. Stages are relatively shorts.

I am glad you got inspiration. I guess the whole community will benefit from that. By the way, I have put a link to your petition, I don’t know if you noticed but so far only Solo said thank you somehow.

No offense, but I’m a little bit surprised by the sudden attitude to say the least.

Also I understood your campaign was focusing on remasters/ports but you seem to be wanting to use it in a different way now since Futatsugi said he was not interested in working on straight ports for the series ?

EDIT: I hope we can run this in a smart way so that the whole community benefits from those efforts.
I don’t want this to become something like the bizarre ShenMue500k…