I like to pose this to all of the WOTA posters here so if you can please participate with your opinions and debate
As many here may be well aware,Sega has started to outsource many of its Ip to western developers to get a foothold in the american market again. Employing the likes of Totally Games and Secret Level to create new versions of classic Sega games. The first Sega IP game to be revealed under this new strategy from Sega is Traveller Tales SUPER MONKEY BALL ADVENTURES which is being described as a platformer with puzzle elements.
The question is that since this outsourcing does not seem limited to classic sega games from the 80s(it seems most of their IP is for sale) if a western studio got the permission to make a PANZER DRAGOON game and they released it tommorrow would you buy it? Knowing that the Orta boys had little or no involvement in the new PD game? Would you even contemplate that possibility and want it to happen?
But if it did happen, I don’t think it would be as bad as some people may think. I think whichever studio got hold of the project would realize what a valuable and cherished series PD is, and it is my belief that they would do all in their power to try to recreate the sort of experiences the series has been known for. It would most definitely be a drastic change, some people would like it, and a majority of others would exile it. Also if it were to happen, it would probably come about as a pure action game, rather than a rail shooter.
I’d be very worried if that happened. Most series that are changed like that in my opinion get ruined. I’d most likely be sticking with the saturn games and orta and ignoring any new ones in that case.
In my opinion a series never get’s “ruined” by getting a bad quality sequel.
I’m still a PD fan and I can still be quoted saying “I love the PD games” even tho I had a number of problems with PDOrta.
Shadow : Who defines what the series needs or doens’t need?Wasn’t PD a great franchise before Saga?
I also would like an RPG for the next game not necesserilly for the roleplaying but just because most RPGs tend to get deeper storylines and room to further explore the world (The PanDra world in this case).
But an adventure game could fill that position as well for example…
As for a western company developing the next PD I don’t think I’d have a problem with that simply because I don’t like stereotypes that much.Besides I think the western companies side is a lot more deiverse in ideas/approaches than the eastern one.
The problem isn’t really about western/eastern since I wouldn’t prefer Namco to Bioware for example…
It has to do with people who’ve worked on the franchise before, working on the new project…
Unless it was such irredeemable crap that no one liked it at all I’d buy it, of course. I was expecting disapointment with Orta right up until I played the demo, I’ll continue to regard any new games that don’t disapoint as a minor miracle no matter who makes them.
With Panzer Dragoon there’s more than just the normal issues of how it plays or whether it’s* japanesey* or not, the story and world have a depth and continuity that’s very rare in videogames, one can hope any developer brave enough to take on the project would have the proper respect for it as Felix said. The other possibility is that they didn’t in which case it would be a PD like game that wouldn’t really count even if it had the name.
As example, more than a few Star Wars fans think KOTOR has a better story and feels more SW than the prequel trilogy did. That’s a case of appropriate collaboration and respect for the source material. So I guess I’m saying any PD game wouldn’t be a real Panzer Dragoon game without the same diligence, craftsmanship and connection to the world itself that the existing four have. Which would necessitate a fundamental colaboration with some of it’s creators anyway.
I actually have a quite complete design that has existed since a few months after I played Saga, evolved since Orta of course. But in my own little fantasy about it I’ve always envisioned the scenario of working with as many of the previous creators as were interested.
I honestly think Panzer Dragoon has a certain life of it’s own, anyone who fundamentally gets it cannot help but become a part of it’s integrity. Or maybe not, but since the PD games have never sold impressively one would think the only reason anyone will ever be trying to make another one is because they just really really want to. So that would give me hope regardless.
Well it all depends what type of PANZER DRAGOON game that would follow up ORTA. Most fans want to see another RPG of PANZER DRAGOON and personally i would love to see the “Orta boys” approch it with what they did with the action adventure RYU GA GOTOKU which blended the SHENMUE engine with GTA. Of course i perfer to see it combined with the PD engine like SAGA did. But of course knowing Sega they may give us what we want but not what we expected and go for a dumb down Action RPG set in the PD universe.Blah.
Bioware’s name has popped up a few times am i getting a sense that these people would be approved if they were to get involved in doing PANZER DRAGOON?
As for bad games well it may not ruin the series overrall but it will tarnish the series. PANZER DRAGOON MINI seems to be loathed by some quarters of the gaming community but its such a rare game not everyone has played it and probably be considered a prize in any serious gamer’s collection more than anything. I feel that ORTA while a great game had a somewhat muted response that didn’t live up to the leagacy of the original Saturn Trilogy.
Am I the only one to want another ORTA ??. I love to see an ORTA II.
SAGA II is still a BIG ask and a massive risk in terms of SEGA getting sales to cover the development costs , and it would no doubt mean that it will hit the PS3 if any system . At least with an ORTA II then some chance of it hitting the 360 . I’ve had it with SONY. SONY can go and fuck them selfs if VF5 goes to 360 .
Anway do the ORTA boys even want to make another SAGA or ORTA . Maybe they’ve had enough with the series (want to try somthing new) , and maybe even feel letdown by the sales of SAGA and ORTA (so why bother) .
When they put so much effort into to them , only to see that not reflected in sales.
I feel better in they really want to make one for the love of the series, rather than just becasue people want to make another in the series. A
I agree that it’s important that they make it when they want to, rather than when it’s expected of them - I’ve always felt that there’s a lot of heart and soul in those games and it’s wouldn’t be the same game if they just churned it out to meet schedule requirements.
But that’s whats been happening for the last year or so Kimimi. Do you think Treasure’s sudden change of heart to do a psuedo sequel to GUNSTAR HEROES was all coincidence? Or that Sega is flogging it’s IP to the highest bidder? Even the return of SHINING FORCE confirms that Sega is basically out to make money and by associating with those that were linked with their glory days and agressivly creating new IP with various houses they hope to bercome the ultimate third party which looks like they’re on set to acheiving.
Orta boys would have no choice if sega ordered them to create a sequel to SAGA or whatever. There seems to be a strong chance of a return to PANZER DRAGOON because of recent events and since it is a well fond title among gamers,it may return via Japan or the west. But lets not kid ourselves that orta boys have any choice in the matter because they don’t.
ORTA was good but uninspired. There won’t be a follow up specifically. Most of the PD games seem to jump generations in each installment from the past to the future and present.
[quote=“Goonboy Panzer”]But that’s whats been happening for the last year or so Kimimi. Do you think Treasure’s sudden change of heart to do a psuedo sequel to GUNSTAR HEROES was all coincidence? Or that Sega is flogging it’s IP to the highest bidder? Even the return of SHINING FORCE confirms that Sega is basically out to make money and by associating with those that were linked with their glory days and agressivly creating new IP with various houses they hope to bercome the ultimate third party which looks like they’re on set to acheiving.
Orta boys would have no choice if sega ordered them to create a sequel to SAGA or whatever. There seems to be a strong chance of a return to PANZER DRAGOON because of recent events and since it is a well fond title among gamers,it may return via Japan or the west. But lets not kid ourselves that orta boys have any choice in the matter because they don’t.
[/quote]
Teasure wannted to make GH II SEGA had no say inthe matter. Treasure stared programing the game months before they took it to SEGA. SO SEGA never put any preasure on Treasure for that
I’m pretty sure it was thanks to calls from the Team that ORTA was made.
I can’t see the money men forcing that one onthe Team or the likes of JSRF.
More I think the Team saw the power of X-Box and knew they could do so much on that Hardware. Panzer Dragoon as always had a very Organic look and feel to it. With the Power of the X-Box I sure the Team saw what could be done in the Panzer world and so wanted to make it , more than the money men. And I see no evidenceor more worrying from the Team that there?s any call for a New Panzer Dragoon game .
I’m still pretty sure that the Team Head have a lot of say on what games are made.
Indeed it was, and it was an even greater series afterward. If you want this series to continue past another sequel, you better hope that sequel isn’t a rail shooter. There’s hardly any market for them anymore, and they don’t sell as well as other genres.
I wans’t thinking of a rail shooter.But an adventure game is also a possibility.I would absolutely love one.
Well in the end these terms (RPG,adventure etc…) are a bit misleading.My adventure PD game would have to have rpg elements and it would have to have combat so…
[quote=“Gehpnaet”]
Well in the end these terms (RPG,adventure etc…) are a bit misleading.My adventure PD game would have to have rpg elements and it would have to have combat so…[/quote]
That was my thought as well, I bet if one is made it will be a merger of various genre’s that will result in a Action-Adventure game with some light RPG elements. Sorry to make this comparison, but kinda like Drakengard but without the on foot fighting.
Teasure wannted to make GH II SEGA had no say inthe matter. Treasure stared programing the game months before they took it to SEGA. SO SEGA never put any preasure on Treasure for that
I’m pretty sure it was thanks to calls from the Team that ORTA was made.
I can’t see the money men forcing that one onthe Team or the likes of JSRF.
More I think the Team saw the power of X-Box and knew they could do so much on that Hardware. Panzer Dragoon as always had a very Organic look and feel to it. With the Power of the X-Box I sure the Team saw what could be done in the Panzer world and so wanted to make it , more than the money men. And I see no evidenceor more worrying from the Team that there?s any call for a New Panzer Dragoon game .
I’m still pretty sure that the Team Head have a lot of say on what games are made.[/quote]
Your missing the point. i’m talking about how the regime at Sega is now compared to the free styling days of the CSK era of Sega. ORTA may have been made because they “felt” like it,but those days are gone and IF Sega wanted them to make a PANZER DRAGOON swimwear special,they would have to do it.
As for GH i dunno about that. What’s the point Sega takijng in a game they didn’t want in the first place? Sega is well aware that GUNSTAR HEROES is a legend among Sega gamers as well as general gaming alike. Since sega actually owns the trademark of the game anyway they would have the final say if they want a game being done or not. Treasure isn’t going to put money into a game to risk Sega declining to take it in especially if they hold the copyright to the IP.
[quote=“Felix”]
[quote=“Gehpnaet”]
Well in the end these terms (RPG,adventure etc…) are a bit misleading.My adventure PD game would have to have rpg elements and it would have to have combat so…[/quote]
That was my thought as well, I bet if one is made it will be a merger of various genre’s that will result in a Action-Adventure game with some light RPG elements. Sorry to make this comparison, but kinda like Drakengard but without the on foot fighting.[/quote]
That’s what i was trying to elude to but it would still need the PD shooting elements of course. Since Sega is scared to make a proper turn based RPG and want a RPG with real time action the SHENMUE F.R.E.E.S engine is the suitable candidate to create an action adventure game of PD. It would be great to roam the world of PD and interact with various tribes and empire henchman etcetc.
[quote]Your missing the point. i’m talking about how the regime at Sega is now compared to the free styling days of the CSK era of Sega. ORTA may have been made because they “felt” like it,but those days are gone and IF Sega wanted them to make a PANZER DRAGOON swimwear special,they would have to do it.
As for GH i dunno about that. What’s the point Sega takijng in a game they didn’t want in the first place? Sega is well aware that GUNSTAR HEROES is a legend among Sega gamers as well as general gaming alike. Since sega actually owns the trademark of the game anyway they would have the final say if they want a game being done or not. Treasure isn’t going to put money into a game to risk Sega declining to take it in especially if they hold the copyright to the IP.[/quote]
And to a point that happend inthe CSK days. I bet Naka was pissed off with SONIC but he had to work on parts III and IV ect for Mega Drive . The great of days of Dreamcast and freeing the Teams would never happen again, even if CSK still had SEGA and the late great Isao Okawa ( RIP) was still alive .
I don’t think SEGA consumer Teams have posted a profit since 1997. Somthing needed to be done, more so after the Dreamcast days (through no fault of the Teams).
SEGA needs to think a lot more about what games are made, But it isn’t all bad They’re porting Out Run II SP to the home, Speing 20 plus million onthe likes of Ryu Ga and Shenmue Online that to me shows a sign that some of the free thiinking is alive and weel in SEGA.
I’m sure the Team Heads still get a lot of say on what games are made, otherwise they could just leave and go it alone .
Treasure were working on GH II months before they took it to SEGA. If SEGA weren’t going to publish it, Treasure were either going to buy the rights off SEGA, or failing that they would have just changed the name and sprites (much like what happen with Project Gotham Racing).
Treasure took it to SEGA as they felt they would be best to push the title in Japan, and becasue there’s still a hell of a lot of respect for SEGA
On foot sequences, if done correctly, would certaintly be intriguing. However I was always under the impression that the gun the rider uses only functions atop the dragon, correct me if i’m wrong here.
It would be pretty crazy and sweet if while you where on foot you were able to jack Empire rifles and other weapons, even melee weapons could be included. Plus, all the while you are fighting on the ground your dragon could provide cover by flying solo in the air. Just some thoughts.
