New Sonic game: Sonic Generations

[Geoffrey]

Again it all depends on the quality of the final game . I really liked fable II even though it was full of bugs and coming from a multi billion dollar corp. The overall quality and gameplay meant you put up with the bugs.

Your money.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Didn’t matter though the early launch worked a treat for MS and got it more market share.
The trouble for all console launches is developers are working on unfinished hardware and tools.[/quote]

Excuses. It could have been a perfect port. It was rushed knowing it would probably sell anyway.

Panzer Dragoon showed the Saturn could do 3D and there shouldn’t have been any doubts after Sega Rally

Too little too late by then. The launch hurt the Saturn’s image too much by then. It gave its rivals the ammunition they needed to show off how the PS could simply do things smoother and flashier.

In fact, the whole Saturn console could have been delayed or remade. Sega was in too much of a hurry when they had a good marketshare in the states.

You can argue this or that but ultimately it could have been better and you cannot deny that.

It was a lovely game, but there so was Daytona USA CE on the Saturn - it just wasn’t a Arcade perfect Daytona USA and that’s what a lot of the fans wanted

The DC game was a great port. Unlike the Saturn games.

If the GFX dept yes - but if you wanted the closest port to the Arcade game in terms of AI and handling the AM#2 Saturn port was the only choice

Lol. It was a rushed poor imitation of the arcade game. You are making excuses when even you know it could have been better.

So because the PS couldn’t handle a port of system 21 game CyberSled (even less power than Model 1 board) the PS was rubbish at handling 3D graphics too ? Don’t come it Duke

The Saturn could have done better. If you don’t believe that then I’ll make a better argument that the Saturn could have been better. Either way, the Saturn lost to the Playstation for a reason and making excuses for its downfall is the absolute last thing anyone needs. Success does not come by making excuses. You have to learn from your mistakes and profit from them to turn a failure into a success.

Sigh… You missing the point that even if you have the market to your self that is no guarantee that your follow up console will go on to win and sweep all before it

And yet it happened. Sony didn’t just release the PS2 with no press. They had a massive marketing machine behind it too which helped it reach people who assumed that a sequel to the world’s most successful console (the Playstation) would probably be just as successful. It doesn’t take a genius to see that.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Who on about gamers you’re quick enough to go on about the PS being easy to program for and having so called better 3D graphics as reason why it won, well the X-Box was much easier to work on and had 3D graphics that were way out in front , but developers still backed the PS2.
Why are developers even working on the PS3 it’s much harder to work on than the 360 after all. In the end Duke its got nothing to do with which machine is easier to work on, but all about Market share.[/quote]

Again, by the time the Xbox arrived the PS2 was already firmly entrenched. So much so that it was enough for gamers.

The PS3 PAID the price this time because Sony has had to face competition from the very start this time and has lost marketshare because of it.

The 360 is being out sold by the PS3 on a worldwide basis , the 360 like the X-Box before it has massive issues and poor sales in most of Mainland Europe and Japan

It is still far more successful than the Xbox in terms of consoles sold. Sony has had to compete a lot more this time.

You honestly DON’T BELIEVE that competition breeds better games?

The X-Box was completive it just came out too late a mistake MS didn’t make with the 360.

Yes for crying out loud. You’ve just repeated something I told you already.

Are you just debating for the sake of winning an argument and just picking holes in everything that is said to have the last word?

They’re not, because casuals don’t go into the shops each week to buy games and that’s reflected in the charts where the more traditionalist games make up the charts each and every week.

LOL. Casual gamers aren’t the majority of gamers? You honestly believe that? They tend to buy big brand games too you know which have been diluted to make themselves more accessible to them. Casual means people who don’t commit a lot of time. It doesn’t necessarily mean mentally challenged.

? A add-on by it’s very nature isn’t built to last let EA supported the Mega CD and 32X . I’ll remind you that SOA was far quicker to cut lose the 32X than the Saturn and EA backed the 3DO to the max. So no EA not backing the DC had nothing to do with a console being built to last and more to with EA wanting to be the only major sports producer on the console . EA plays big balls when it wants too. SONY stopped it NFL games on the PS2 (I wonder why) and even MS had to cut its own NFL games and cancel XSN to get EA to come onoard X-Box LIVE

Yeah EA supports winners and goes where it can make a profit. So?

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Yeah SEGA fault for wanting to make a rival to Madden . And yes losing Camelot was a mistake and should have been handled better but that happens in the industry and as for cutting the Saturn lose too early the Saturn was supported by SEGA Japan for as long or longer than MS supported the X-Box or NCL with the Cube (4 years repetitively)
Again your double standards on such issues is getting a bit much now.[/quote]

EA didn’t support the DC. So what? You expect EA to support Sega after the Saturn? Maybe if the DC had lived longer and maintained 10 million users, then you may have seen support from EA.

You can’t blame EA for not wanting to support a failure.

Again is subjective .

No it is not. The DC performed miles better outside Japan thanks to games that actually grabbed their audience.

Gears of War better than HALO or the likes of Ninja Gaiden now you’re having a laugh imo and the PS3 launched a year after the 360;very similar to the X-Box launching a year a bit after the PS2 and Gears did not put to shame the likes of Killzone 2 in the GFX dept.

If you mean that Killzone 2 movie then sure, but a movie is all it was. Gears et al forced Sony to compete more. But the 360 showed that it was here to stay and was a better console despite Sony releasing a bit later.

Why don’t you just look at the consoles sold for each? The PS3 is not the PS2.

Yes that was the key going early.

Yes and having the games that can compete right at the start as well.

I don’t think the PS got the best version and well market share and poor sales put pay to red Alet.

The PS version got the extra missions.

Now you’re again changing the goal posts there . The Wii is best selling console this gen you 're going to tell me that it has the best and bigger 3rd party support out of all the current consoles

Nintendo honed in on a DIFFERENT market and stayed profitable.

If the DC reached Mass market SEGA would still be in the Harwdare game, it flopped in Europe , sold poor in Japan and only did well in USA - That is not mass Market at all.

Compared to the Saturn it did a hell of a lot better, and the U.S. is a vital not to mention the most demanding market. The DC didn’t have the time it needed to grow but it took off considerably better than the Saturn.

Are you really going to argue that the Saturn was better than the DC? Really?

Have you even played the game ? The 3d transparent effects were limited at best even in the PS version. The big difference was the shading on the Characters, but to make up for that the Saturn version had better controls , more detailed backgrounds new enemies and pretty brilliant Battle Game

It was a late and imperfect port which the Saturn got while the PS got the even better sequel. RE2 is considered one of the best games in the whole series but it was a PS exclusive for that generation (I don’t count the Ultra 64 since that was between the generations).

Good job? Now Veronica was awesome and competitive (and better than the later PS2 version graphically), and we would have got RE4 and/or Devil May Cry on the DC if Sega hadn’t pulled the plug.

But that doesn’t bother you, right?

There is not point, because you’re not being serious anymore. Did the DC get RE 4, RE Outbreak ECT ?. That’s what happens why your console loses market share.

Blame Sega for thinking that Japan is the center of the universe, otherwise you would have got RE4 for the DC.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]It was when used right as shown in some games - Its just a same developers didn’t put the time and effort in and just tried to run C on the Saturn. You at the PS3 its way more powerful than the 360 but in a lot of cases you’l never know it and a lot of 3rd parties took the easy route of trying to run 360 code on the machine
The Saturn should have been able to handle 3D transparent effects granted, but there Model 2 couldn’t either.[/quote]

The 360 was designed to be more competitive by being dev friendly. Like Sony was with the PS until it decided to try and force devs to waste time on the PS2 to keep all the games there by making it unprofitable to go multi-platform.

Screw Sony. They got what they deserved.

As for the Saturn, Sega could have made a better console you know.

It was a shame, has was no Fifa for the DC that could have made a world of diffrence as would having FF 7 on the Saturn which would have killed the PS in Japan .

Probably. The PS was still a better console in terms of being competitive.

So stop saying I’m doing the noble thing by buying garage . I happen to like Yakuza series and it’s far from garbage even if it’s getting milked far too much for it’s own good.

You did buy Sonic 2006, right?

I never said it was, only that making a AAA game isn’t a nailed on way to get sales either.

You can make AAA games that give a lot of people what they want, you know?

In your opinion . There’s lots of IP from various different companies that are rife for a next gen update but sales of the past series puts pay to that even from EA. I mean EA could make a top next gen version of Star Flight that could put Mass effect to same, but I’ll bet it wont

I can accept them being discontinued. What I cannot accept is Sega being so mediocre when we all know it could be so much more.

In the meantime, we’ll support great gaming instead regardless of who makes it.

[Team_Andromeda]

Your money.

Well seeing as the game sold over 3 million copies it’s not just my money and shows people will buy games unfinished and with bugs.

Excuses. It could have been a perfect port. It was rushed knowing it would probably sell anyway

Excuses ? . Developers will be working on guess work for the start , given that hardly any of the final chipset of a console is finished and development of the console chipet is consistently changing right up until the last min as are it’s tool set.

Too little too late by then

Panzer Dragoon came out before Daytona USA duke and SEGA Rally was on its release the best selling CD game ever in the UK.

It gave its rivals the ammunition they needed to show off how the PS could simply do things smoother and flashier.

Only the PS didn’t do Cybersled smoother or flashier , but no-one goes on about that game

In fact, the whole Saturn console could have been delayed or remade. Sega was in too much of a hurry when they had a good marketshare in the states

In fact you are wrong.
The Saturn didn’t launch until 6 years after the Mega Drive, the same life span that was for the Snes to the N64 the PS to the PS2. Where SEGA screwed up was with no Sonic for the system (untill it was too late and even then it wasn’t a true Sonic game and SEGA thinking it could development support and produce 2 32bit consoles at the same time as well as trying to take on NCL and SONY.

The DC game was a great port. Unlike the Saturn games.

Unless you happend to like Model 2 AI and handling .

. It was a rushed poor imitation of the arcade game.

The Saturn version had a wealth of extra and bonus content and was in gameplay terms a perfect port . The Gfx engine was what let the game down and I’ll not make any excuse for that- but the game played better than the DC version due to it having the Arcade handling and AI .

the Saturn lost to the Playstation for a reason

Yes 32X in the West and Square going to Sony in Japan.

They had a massive marketing machine behind it too which helped it reach people who assumed that a sequel to the world’s most successful console

All thing you could say with the PS3, yet it’s outsold by the 360 and Wii .

Again, by the time the Xbox arrived the PS2 was already firmly entrenched. So much so that it was enough for gamers.

Again the Wii and PS3 lauched a year after the 360, yet it never hurt the Wii.

It is still far more successful than the Xbox in terms of consoles sold.

Some would say there’s only 20 million working 360 :P. MS build a soild base with the X-Box and just built on that, but issues of being seen as boy’s console all about FPS and not selling well in Japan and mainland Europe still remain

[quote]
You honestly DON’T BELIEVE that competition breeds better games[/quote]

Not just better games, but better consoles

Casual gamers aren’t the majority of gamers? You honestly believe that? They tend to buy big brand games too you know which have been diluted to make themselves more accessible to them.

Casuals don’t buy the likes of COD, HALO, GTA 5, Uncharted 3, Assassin’s Creed Duke that gamers buying them and those games still make up the majority of the charts . Gamers go into the shops each week to buy games, causals don’t . If that was the case the Wii would have the best 3rd party support and best there is release schedule.

Yeah EA supports winners and goes where it can make a profit. So

Thank you, it s nothing to do with consoles built to last and all about market share and control of your IP.

EA didn’t support the DC. So what? You expect EA to support Sega after the Saturn? Maybe if the DC had lived longer and maintained 10 million users, then you may have seen support from EA

EA were never going to support the DC and now you’re changing your tune yet again. It had nothing to do with the Saturn at all, I bet EA will support the Wii U or the Vita despite PSP doing crap for EA.

You can’t blame EA for not wanting to support a failure

No I wouldn’t just my point. All about Marketshare.

The DC performed miles better outside Japan thanks to games that actually grabbed their audience

It did better in the USA duke and that’s why it gets more coverage - That doesn’t make it a better games console at all . Most Americans don’t give a toss about the Master System or the NEC PC-eng despite them being fine games consoles . Now for a games console it all about games and that is subjective - I enjoyed the Saturn range of games more than the DC, there again I enjoyed the SNES range over the Mega Drive.

If you mean that Killzone 2 movie then sure, but a movie is all it was. Gears et al forced Sony to compete more.

I mean the actually game which eats into Gears on the Graphical front.

But the 360 showed that it was here to stay and was a better console despite Sony releasing a bit later

Subjective because in the Gfx front the PS3 is way on in front imo, and for the 1st year the 360 wasn’t really doing that great and was being outsold by the PS2 . It took a while to get going and we all knew the 360 was here to stay thanks the MS money

The PS version got the extra missions

So that makes it better then because you get extra’s / I’ll try and remember that when playing RE on the Saturn.

Nintendo honed in on a DIFFERENT market and stayed profitable.

Who’s making excuses now then ?

Compared to the Saturn it did a hell of a lot better, and the U.S. is a vital not to mention the most demanding market

The point was the DC wasn’t mass Market and DC had plenty of time to grow but the market place and 3rd parties didnt give SEGA a chance .

Are you really going to argue that the Saturn was better than the DC? Really?

Yes if we’re talking about games , if you’re talking of market share then no

It was a late and imperfect port which the Saturn got while the PS got the even better sequel

I though it was a better version of the game myself.

RE2 is considered one of the best games in the whole series but it was a PS exclusive for that generation (I don’t count the Ultra 64 since that was between the generations

Rather silly , did the DC get RE 4 which many consider to be the best RE game ever made ?
But that doesn’t bother you right ?

and we would have got RE4 and/or Devil May Cry on the DC if Sega hadn’t pulled the plug

And we would have got RE 2 on the Saturn (which was announced) had the focus not shifted to the DC.

Blame Sega for thinking that Japan is the center of the universe, otherwise you would have got RE4 for the DC

SEGA knew it had lost Japan very early in and was pinning all its hopes on the DC selling well in USA and Europe, sadly we had a baboon in charge of Europe at the time

The 360 was designed to be more competitive by being dev friendly

being developer friendly means jack shit with out marketshare - Otherwise the DC and Cube would have been the supported consoles out there

Screw Sony. They got what they deserved

Yeah millions in profit , the best selling console ever and the best 3rd party support for a console ever .

As for the Saturn, Sega could have made a better console you know.

Yes when it come to 3D transparent effects and the piss poor early development tools granted.

The PS was still a better console in terms of being competitive

If Square had gone to the Saturn in Japan it would have been the end of the PS in Japan (which for 2 years was being out sold by the Saturn) and if Fifa and Madden had gone to the DC, I think the DC would have done so much better in the West . It’s all if and but’s though

You did buy Sonic 2006, right?

Yeah I did , but we all buy a dud game for time to time.

You can make AAA games that give a lot of people what they want, you know

I consider O.TO.GI to be a brilliant action game, far better than DMC it sold like crap, Enslaved a perfect adv game and it sold poor, JSRF to be one of the best games ever made sold like crap, Rallisport II to be brilliant, Alan Wake ,Alien Resurrection to be utterly brilliant onthe PS, Beyond Good and Evil to be stunning and sold poor, Project Snowblind an great FPS, Singularity and original and top FPS , XIII another top FPS that didn’t sell
So you can give gamers what you think they want, make AAA games on some of the best selling systems and that doesn’t mean you get the sales at the end of the day

What I cannot accept is Sega being so mediocre when we all know it could be so much more.

Oh I agree, but that doesn’t change the fact that poor sales are the main reason why we’ll not see a Saga II or Shenmue III and you can not blame SEGA for that, because that’s not being fair.

[Solo_Wing]

EDIT: and eh, guys, the quote wars are getting a bit out of control here…

I read every post on these forums, but I tend to only skim over these quote wars. There are too many points flying around to keep track of a coherent argument (if there even is one).

[Geoffrey]

Well seeing as the game sold over 3 million copies it’s not just my money and shows people will buy games unfinished and with bugs.

It’s their money to waste.

Excuses ? . Developers will be working on guess work for the start , given that hardly any of the final chipset of a console is finished and development of the console chipet is consistently changing right up until the last min as are it’s tool set.

Excuses still. It could have been a perfect port. If I have the choice between that and a better PC version, I’ll stick with the PC version any day.

Panzer Dragoon came out before Daytona USA duke and SEGA Rally was on its release the best selling CD game ever in the UK.

Daytona was a terrible port that could have been better. You don’t want to admit it just for the sake of winning an argument.

The Saturn’s launch games were terrible except for PD which was already oldschool by that time.

Only the PS didn’t do Cybersled smoother or flashier , but no-one goes on about that game

PS = 100 million consoles sold.
Saturn = 8 mil or something?

The PS wins.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]In fact you are wrong.
The Saturn didn’t launch until 6 years after the Mega Drive, the same life span that was for the Snes to the N64 the PS to the PS2. Where SEGA screwed up was with no Sonic for the system (untill it was too late and even then it wasn’t a true Sonic game and SEGA thinking it could development support and produce 2 32bit consoles at the same time as well as trying to take on NCL and SONY. [/quote]

Excuses again. The N64 may have arrived late but it did considerably better than the Saturn because Nintendo hadn’t burned as many bridges.

The Saturn should have been better considering who was making it.

When the PS was so good, you can’t make excuses for Sega. It could have been done.

Unless you happend to like Model 2 AI and handling .

The joke of a Saturn port just didn’t have what it took to survive and thrive in the eyes of the mainstream.

The Saturn version had a wealth of extra and bonus content and was in gameplay terms a perfect port . The Gfx engine was what let the game down and I’ll not make any excuse for that- but the game played better than the DC version due to it having the Arcade handling and AI .

Yes, the graphics were abysmal.

All thing you could say with the PS3, yet it’s outsold by the 360 and Wii .

Because of real competition. We’ve been over this.

Again the Wii and PS3 lauched a year after the 360, yet it never hurt the Wii.

The Wii wasn’t trying to compete with either the 360 or PS3.

Some would say there’s only 20 million working 360 :P. MS build a soild base with the X-Box and just built on that, but issues of being seen as boy’s console all about FPS and not selling well in Japan and mainland Europe still remain

It’s still forced Sony to compete.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Casuals don’t buy the likes of COD, HALO, GTA 5, Uncharted 3, Assassin’s Creed Duke that gamers buying them and those games still make up the majority of the charts . Gamers go into the shops each week to buy games, causals don’t . If that was the case the Wii would have the best 3rd party support and best there is release schedule.
[/quote]

So you think that real hardcore gamers outnumber normal people. Ok. You must have a different definition of gamer.

EA were never going to support the DC and now you’re changing your tune yet again. It had nothing to do with the Saturn at all, I bet EA will support the Wii U or the Vita despite PSP doing crap for EA.

Sega were losers. End of story really.

It did better in the USA duke…

See we finally agree. DC > Saturn.

Subjective because in the Gfx front the PS3 is way on in front imo…

I have lost count of the inferior multi-platform games on the PS3.

So that makes it better then because you get extra’s / I’ll try and remember that when playing RE on the Saturn.

The PS got the sequels as well. The Saturn couldn’t even handle RE2.

Who’s making excuses now then ?

Nintendo aimed for a different market to stay profitable. That was a good move by them because Nintendo can’t really compete with the giants.

The point was the DC wasn’t mass Market and DC had plenty of time to grow but the market place and 3rd parties didnt give SEGA a chance .

The DC wasn’t here for 5 whole years. It wasn’t even here for half that and yet its line up was stunning for the time. God only knows what else we would have seen.

if you’re talking of market share then no

I think you are under the impression that the U.S. wasn’t the most important market, which it was.

I though it was a better version of the game myself.

In the eyes of an average “gamer” all they’d seen is inferior graphics of an old game which has a new sequel on a more popular console.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Rather silly , did the DC get RE 4 which many consider to be the best RE game ever made ?
But that doesn’t bother you right ? [/quote]

It would have got it if the DC had lived and especially if it took off more in Japan.

And we would have got RE 2 on the Saturn (which was announced) had the focus not shifted to the DC.

You mean an inferior port, while Capcom made RE3 for the PS. You never know.

being developer friendly means jack shit with out marketshare - Otherwise the DC and Cube would have been the supported consoles out there

It’s a good start to be competitive as the PS clearly showed.

Yeah millions in profit , the best selling console ever and the best 3rd party support for a console ever .

Competition is good for gaming you see.

[quote=“Team Andromeda”]I consider O.TO.GI to be a brilliant action game, far better than DMC it sold like crap, Enslaved a perfect adv game and it sold poor, JSRF to be one of the best games ever made sold like crap, Rallisport II to be brilliant, Alan Wake ,Alien Resurrection to be utterly brilliant onthe PS, Beyond Good and Evil to be stunning and sold poor, Project Snowblind an great FPS, Singularity and original and top FPS , XIII another top FPS that didn’t sell
So you can give gamers what you think they want, make AAA games on some of the best selling systems and that doesn’t mean you get the sales at the end of the day [/quote]

Well you know if real gamers were a majority, those titles may have sold better. But the market is generally braindead and herded.

Oh I agree, but that doesn’t change the fact that poor sales are the main reason why we’ll not see a Saga II or Shenmue III and you can not blame SEGA for that, because that’s not being fair.

The Sega you knew is dead. You are defending a company that forgot about much of its past already. At least Nintendo adapted. Sega did much better with the DC as far as competing with the status quo goes.

I think I have decided to just go where the non gamers aren’t. Fanboys make me lose all faith in humanity because they take an identity from a brand that they think can do no wrong. It’s frustrating.

[Geoffrey]

[quote=“Solo”]

EDIT: and eh, guys, the quote wars are getting a bit out of control here…

I read every post on these forums, but I tend to only skim over these quote wars. There are too many points flying around to keep track of a coherent argument (if there even is one).[/quote]

Yeah you know what. I’ll stop right here.

It was a completely pointless debate that makes me wish I’d never even commented.

If someone wishes to discuss the actual game, feel free. I am done debating.

[Team_Andromeda]

It’s their money to waste.

It not a waste if you happen to like and enjoy the product.

Excuses still. It could have been a perfect port.

Sorry Model 2 was a world away from the Saturn, so a perfect port was not a goer at.

Daytona was a terrible port that could have been better

The game engine could have been better , the game it’s self was brilliant a perfect port in gameplay, brilliant new music and extra’s

The Saturn’s launch games were terrible except for PD which was already oldschool by that time

Well PD wasn’t a launch title and 3D shooters were still decent sellers in those days and VF was a brilliant launch title. I will agree with western Saturn launch was terrible thanks to SEGA West going all for the 32X.

[quote]PS = 100 million consoles sold.
Saturn = 8 mil or something[/quote]

So that’s it then lets go just the sales ?. Go by that the DC was a total waste of space and a rubbish console.

The N64 may have arrived late but it did considerably better than the Saturn because Nintendo hadn’t burned as many bridges.

Not excuses just the facts that the Saturn launched 6 years after the Mega Drive the same 6 years it took SONY to make a sequel to PS and NCL to the Snes.

Because of real competition. We’ve been over this

We have but you’re not being fair.

The Wii wasn’t trying to compete with either the 360 or PS3.

Don’t give me that cop out.

So you think that real hardcore gamers outnumber normal people. Ok. You must have a different definition of gamer

No that is not the point I’m making at all . A gamer goes into the shops and buy games each a casual does not - they buy the system and a few games each year , but they do not buy games each week like a gamer does.
That is reflected in the charts- Please don’t make out that Uncharted, Tomb Raider, GTA, COD, Medal Of Honor, Fable, GT, Gears Of War, Elder Scrolls, Dirt, F1,Tom" Clancy, Assassin’s Creed, FIFA ECT are games for the casuals . These are games and just because they happen to sell in Huge numbers does not make them casual games

Sega were losers. End of story really

Not say otherwise, but again that’s a different point.

See we finally agree. DC > Saturn.

Shouldn’t that be PS2>PS>N64>DC.

I have lost count of the inferior multi-platform games on the PS3.

Sigh… For one, like with the Saturn, lots of developers at the start of the PS3 just tried to run another consoles code and that showed in the poor ports . That never chances the fact that when used right the PS3 is doing stuff way beyond the 360 (just Play Killzone III and GOD Of War III).

The PS got the sequels as well. The Saturn couldn’t even handle RE2

Well the DC didn’t get a sequel to CV so that must mean its crap too. And the Saturn could handle RE 2 the port was dropped due to market issues.

That was a good move by them because Nintendo can’t really compete with the giants.

More excuses again . NCL couldn’t take on a giant but SEGA could ? I love your double standards Duke and I’ll try and remind you that even in the 8 and 16 bit days NCL was a GIANT compared to SEGA with 6 billion more in the bank.

The DC wasn’t here for 5 whole years.

It had 2 years and if your console fails to make it then, it’s never going to make it

I think you are under the impression that the U.S. wasn’t the most important market, which it was

It’s always been the most important really, more so than ever now. That’s a different to point to which console has the better games though.

In the eyes of an average “gamer” all they’d seen is inferior graphics of an old game

old I thought C&C was at its hight at time of the port and I think most people expected PC ports to suffer in the downgrade to consoles even now . Battle Field III looks better on PC, not that I think 360/PS3 expected anything less and I don’t think 360 users cared at all that Orange Box was a port of a Older PC game, do you ?

It would have got it if the DC had lived and especially if it took off more in Japan

The exact same arguments one could say with the Saturn and RE2.

You mean an inferior port, while Capcom made RE3 for the PS

And one could just say the DC version of RE4 would have been inferior given it couldn’t handle the polygons, lighting effects ect of the PS2 or Cube.

It’s a good start to be competitive as the PS clearly showed.

And as the PS2 showed it means jack shit more so as the PS2 was one of the hardest consoles to developer on.

Competition is good for gaming you see.

I know, I’m in favour of the Capitalist system see,. So why you have an issue with it, I do not know . To do well in the Capitalist system would must be the strongest and make the best products.

Well you know if real gamers were a majority, those titles may have sold better

The X-Box was a real gamers machine and that showed in the games to console ratio . It just that some games hit the mark better than others even if you make a AAA FPS.

The Sega you knew is dead

Sigh … I said that in the Yakuza thread . The day of SEGA making the games it wanted too are over, now it got to make games it thinks or hopes will sell and want the market wants . Well that market showed there is no market for Saga or Shenmue never mind they’re old school (if we want to class PD as old school) . So why you expect SEGA to make sequels to these is beyond me, more so when you’re ok with EA dropping IP that doesn’t sell.

Now I too would rather talk about the game, more so as it actually good !

[Draikin]

If anyone’s interested, you can now get the PC from Steam for around ? 10, but the discount only lasts a day:

http://store.steampowered.com/app/71340/

[UrbanReflex]

Got this for Christmas. It’s actually really fun.

The classic Sonic stuff is pretty much what you’d expect. The re-imagining of the levels in 2.5D is quite spectacular though, it breathes a whole new life into what you hadn’t realised were rather aged levels.

The modern Sonic stuff is some of the best I’ve seen since Sonic Adventure 1. A lot of the stupid control issues have been fixed and you can actually build a good amount of speed up rather than having to be careful to avoid the drops.

I’ve not fought the first boss yet, but already there seems to be quite a lot of content crammed in. The challenges are pretty neat, I like the way they’ve created new architecture and re-used stuff from the main levels.

Impressed so far.

[Ancient_Weapon]

Someone gave Green Hill Zone a Christmas makeover. Very nice!

[Solo_Wing]

Zero Punctuation reviews Sonic Generations:
escapistmagazine.com/videos/ … enerations

“Controlling Sonic in 3D gameplay is like holding onto a bar of soap in the bath.”

Warning, contains spoilers about the final level.

[Shelcoof]

[quote=“Solo”]Zero Punctuation reviews Sonic Generations:
escapistmagazine.com/videos/ … enerations

“Controlling Sonic in 3D gameplay is like holding onto a bar of soap in the bath.”

Warning, contains spoilers about the final level.[/quote]

I wonder if some people hate on Sonic just for sport or what? I mean seriously, 3D Sonic handles even better than on the Dreamcast era, i have never felt i was lacking control ( except for the 3D bosses, those were really bad).

[Solo_Wing]

Yahtzee’s videos are usually rants, but he’s quite good at pointing where games could be improved. I recall he didn’t like SA1 much either. I do agree though that 3D Sonic’s controls could be significantly improved (for reasons I’ve mentioned earlier).

[Shelcoof]

Why don’t you give me some reason on why it’s gonna be great? My reason for thinking it’s gonna be shit is that I’ve seen nothing that looks promising even though all we’ve seen is 100% controlled media that are supposed to make it look its best like every company does for their products before letting others take them for a spin.

Looks like you were wrong, Binary Domain is actually pretty good.

Lesson to be learn never judge a book by its cover