Why a rider?

One thing that has been bothering me recently that I’m sure that you people with better memories for the games than I do can either outright answer or theorize is… why does the Heresy Dragon need a rider?

It makes sense why he brings Edge along, because Edge has the Divine Visitor in him, but what about the rest of the times? Lundi may have been along for the ride as a good friend, especially since the dragon was still small when they started out, but why did the dragon bother picking up Kyle after losing the Sky Rider? Regardless of whether the Sky Rider was drone or human, Kyle was a complete stranger to the dragon and arguably unnecessary for completing his mission.

Unnecessary? It’s the synchronization of the dragoon/dragon that makes them such an effective killing machine :slight_smile: alone they are great but together they are unmatched :slight_smile:

One of my older theories that was trying to explain gameplay elements of the pd series with an actual story point was that the dragon is able to fire at enemies behind him or to the sides because the rider (us) can see them and with the synchronization/bonding they have the dragon senses them as well so can fire at them :slight_smile:
That’s an example of how the rider could aid the dragon in battle I suppose (even if this particular example is wrong:)

And plz let’s call him Lagi or ust dragon :wink: we never ride just the Heresy Dragon, we ride the duo coolia_named_Lagi+Heresy program and in Orta in fact we just ride Lagi separated from the Heresy program :slight_smile:

My opinion of why Team Andromeda had a rider on the dragon at all is that the idea came from Moebius’ “Arzach” graphic novels / comics, which the team stated were one of the original inspirations for Panzer Dragoon.

Plot-wise though, remember that the Heresy Program morphed Lagi-the-Coolia’s body into the physical design of an actual Ancient Age dragon. The dragons were the ultimate organic weapon created by the Ancients, and they evidently designed them to only reach their full potential when they were aided by a rider.

This was possibly a safeguard to keep them under control. A normal Ancient Age dragon/rider relationship would presumably be like Azel and Atolm, where the dragon was essentially a massive weapon-vehicle wielded by the Drone.

The Guardian Dragon and Water Dragon don’t have a rider though :slight_smile:
No wonder they go down so easy :wink:

Oh and if the Ancients were able to be safe with their drones then they could apply the same safety measures to the dragons as well so that alone can’t be the reason :slight_smile: I’m sure it also makes them more effective, or else there would be no need for the “bonding”

The rider adds a lot to the games. Without a rider, there would be no story, just a dragon flying around shooting people for no obvious reason.

You can fantasize about being a dragon rider, flying through the air on the back of the mighty beast, and that’s cool. Fantasizing about being the dragon itself is just lame.

A slightly illogical event in a game is a small sacrefice if it vastly improves quality.

[quote=“Al3xand3r”]The Guardian Dragon and Water Dragon don’t have a rider though :slight_smile:
No wonder they go down so easy :wink:

Oh and if the Ancients were able to be safe with their drones then they could apply the same safety measures to the dragons as well so that alone can’t be the reason :slight_smile: I’m sure it also makes them more effective, or else there would be no need for the “bonding”[/quote]

Good point - it could be because it offers up more options, then. If the Drone is the controlling mind of the unit and the dragon is the firepower, it would essentially allow the Ancients the ability to equip different Drones with different weapons.

I’m pretty sure the Water Dragon (and Glide Dragons) aren’t actually “dragons” in the sense we’re considering, though - but the Guardian Dragon’s absence of a Drone does prove that they can operate independantly. (If I remember correctly, Atolm is implied to be operating independantly of Azel when she’s alone in Uru, too.)

Dopefish’s right; it’s much easier for people to relate to the main character of a story when they’re at least reasonably human.

Ya know, that’s what I hate so much about this forum: the members here are such rabbid fans that they answer everyone’s questions so thoroughly in such a short amount of time that people like me have nothing left to say! Gah!

Anyway, yes, I think I’ve heard quite a few references to dragon’s senses and capabilities being enhanced when they’re accompanied by a rider. However, they can operate independantly, as they have done in all the games. In PDS, the dragon was able to fight and act without a rider (such as when he saved Edge in the begining, and again when Edge was stuck in the Uru ruins), and the dragon also saved Orta from the two Dragonmares on it’s own. I think one of the background texts in Orta mentions something about riders being required to keep Dragons from becoming too powerful on their own and to make sure they don’t turn on their masters.

The Dragons presumably know this, and will “instinctivly” find a rider as soon as they can. Ironically, this was one of the major plot holes people pointed out in the (apperently horrible) Panzer Dragoon Anime that was released a while ago, since noone could understand why the bad dragon kidnapped the main character’s girlfriend/wife (not sure what she was, haven’t seen the show myself).

A dragon isn’t intelegent.If the Heresy Program was omnipotent in THIS world then it wouldn’t need a rider for his physicall shell…

But it isn’t omnipotent so…

And who knows, if the ancients didn’t keep their dragons under control, such dragons might be tempted to “terminate all the active ruins and Towers”.

It’s simple really. The dragon’s main weapon is the luminous missles it fires. They take a bit of time to charge up, so they need an armed rider to provide cover fire while it takes that moment to recharge.

You have played the games, right? :slight_smile:

I’m sorry, I guess I didn’t see the Dark Rider’s (or what do we call that guy? I forget) or Azel’s guns then eh :P? Cover fire can’t be the reason, there would still be no need for the bonding process.

And actually the blasts don’t take time to recharge in the shooter games, what I did when I played Zwei was hold down the A button and then kept rapidly tapping the B button and so both Dragon and rider were shooting very very fast if I remember right. Perhaps it was just dragon fire like that though, I don’t remember very well. On bosses that took a lot of hits to take down, rather than wait for all the lock ons and then release I used this technique instead :slight_smile:

And also dragons are intelligent Gehn, what makes you think they aren’t ? In the first game we get a “the dragon knows the way” and it’s basically the dragon leading the rider, how is that not being intelligent? Same goes for all the times the dragons have operated without a rider throughout the games, both Lagi and Atolm.
And this also counters Lance’s point that says the drones are the controlling mind and the dragons the firepower.

And Geoffrey, not all dragons can take down towers :slight_smile: Heresy was designed for that though, and again, whatever “safeguard” device they applied to drones they could apply to dragons as well. If that method isn’t secure enough then by adding a drone to control the dragon they basically have double the chance of something going wrong, either the dragon malfunctioning and not listening to the rider and doing what it wants or the drone malfunctioning and leading the dragon against the Ancients too :slight_smile:

I believe this is explained in PDO’s encyclopedia somewhere

I do realize that from the player’s perspective, it’s more fun to have a rider. :wink: Panzer Dragoon wasn’t the first shooter involving a flying dragon (Dragon Spirit is the oldest one I can think of it), but it does seem to be the first to incorporate a rider. As was pointed out, the dragon already knows the way in PD1, so picking up Kyle wasn’t because it lacked the intelligence necessary to finish its mission. Maybe having a rider helps because of added firepower (someone to cover the rear so to speak), but Lagi is the only dragon who ever gets a rider with a weapon.

The thing is… I can see from the perspective of a rider why the dragon would be useful. Azel can do a lot more with Atolm helping her. He’s companion, weapons system, and transportation all rolled into one. I’m not sure how much having a rider helps a dragon though, aside from being able to walk into locations too small for the dragon to fit through.

Maybe that’s why the Guardian Dragon doesn’t bother with a rider? I’m just thinking aloud at this point since that still doesn’t answer why Kyle gets to come along other than to serve as a plot device.

[quote=“Rune Lai”]
Maybe that’s why the Guardian Dragon doesn’t bother with a rider? I’m just thinking aloud at this point since that still doesn’t answer why Kyle gets to come along other than to serve as a plot device.[/quote]

For some reason I always pictured the Guardian Dragon as more of a lifeless drone/machine than an actual dragon.

PD1, Episode 4 boss.
PDZ, Episode 5 boss.

Both invulnerable to Lagi’s lasers, therefore the dragon needs a rider! :slight_smile:

I thought we had come to an agreement on the rider benig a failsafe, so to speak, on an otherwise perfect weapon.

I think the Box in Orta theorizes something along those lines, too.

There was a Rider in Panzer dragoon Mini or not? I can’t remember. :smiley:

I didn’t see a rider in Mini, but then again someone must have been there to ‘shoot’ normally, shouldn’t they? I sense a ‘plot’ hole in PD Mini…

Someone mentioned a theory a while back about the guardian dragon’s drone being the one who controlled Shelcoof. There isn’t any evidence to back this up, but it’s an interesting possibility.

Two excerpts from the Encyclopedia in PDO:

Dragonriders: Some of the rare sightings of dragons tell of humans who ride atop their backs, despite their innate aggressive nature. A normal human is little equipped to withstand the sheer force involved in dragon combat or flight, so it seems safe to assume that the dragon creates some sort of barrier to protect the rider from impacts and enemy attacks. From this, it is hypothesized that dragons were originally designed as manned weapons, controlled perhaps by drones. It appears that dragons require the sharing of thought and senses with a rider to realize their full potential as a combat organism. Why they are incomplete by design remains a mystery, but some speculate that this is a safeguard on an otherwise perfect and all-powerful being. Also, while the rider is in contact with the dragon, the rider’s physical abilities and senses are heightened. Furthermore, even after the direct contact ends, strong residual influence to personality and intelligence have also been reported. Some old texts tell of riders who felt no fear or compassion while riding dragons. While the details are unknown, it seems clear that once a human comes into contact with these godly creatures and gets a glimpse of their extraordinary world, it is difficult to return to the world of the normal and mundane. For their riders as well, dragons can be the bringers of happiness or despair.


Dragon: A type of “Engineered Monster”–a creation of ancient technology, designed as a living weapon. Its large wings and robust armor supplement the bioluminary oscillator in its throat, the source of the deadly Arrows of Light. Also, it has the ability to rapidly evolve of its own volition, to adapt to its environment and experiences. It is said that dragons appear in times of great war and upheaval, preceded by storms and violent weather. To some, they are terrible and loathsome harbingers of destruction. To others, they are divine objects of faith and adulation. But now, in the decades following the Great Fall, no living human has told of seeing a dragon. For years, the Imperial Academy has poured its considerable resources into dragon-related
research, for the dragon is the epitome of combat power sought by the Empire. While the research resulted in a crippling death blow to the Empire, as the wounded state began to rebuild, it was also able to gather valuable information about dragons and ancient technology from amidst the rubble of its crumbled glory.