Well agehn I don’t know for sure which are D&D and which aren’t but from the games I played that you guys mentioned Planescape Torment is certainly my favourite.
[quote=“Jinx”]How does Icewind Dale’s combat compare to BG2’s and Diablo 2’s (singleplayer)? I was thinking about getting the IWD1/2 double pack for my more narcissistic powergamery moods.
But I found the combat in BG2 a bit too fiddly, and I recently read a PCGamer review of the pack comparing it unfavourably to Diablo 2.[/quote]
It’s a lot like Baldur’s Gate II though I think it uses an older version of the D&D ruleset therefor there are differences in spells/effects and such. I wouldn’t compare the games to Diablo 2, they may be hack and slash but the combat has far more depth and difficulty (duh, it’s D&D). They don’t offer a frantic clickfest like D2 does if that’s what you are looking for (take a look at Titan Quest if so). In fact it’s probably better to use the auto-pause options as real-time mode might get you killed…
But, if you didn’t like the combat in BG then you won’t like the combat in these either as the basics and the engine itself (in Icewind Dale’s case, I think the sequel had a new engine) are identical and, once again, the whole game is much much harder, especially to start with.
I enjoyed Icewind Dale a lot myself. BGII was an epic RPG but you aren’t always in the mood for something that vast and Icewind Dale offered me the same quality of gameplay without focusing on the storyline/open ended aspects of Baldur’s Gate II that made it too deep to dive into at times.
Anyway, off topic: I’m currently playing Gothic 3 and loving it despite some issues. Yeah it’s not D&D but it’s a fantastic RPG in its own right.
There’re a few things that make me suspect I might actually like ID despite its lukewarm reception:
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The same writers as Planescape (and, I think, Fallout 2). Story or no, I’m expecting reasonably good, non-cliche-ridden dialogue.
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I think I’m a powergamer at heart. It wastes a lot of time, but there’s something so compelling about it.
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The music. Again, same guy as Planescape. BG2’s music annoyed the crap out of me. Planescape’s is some of the best game music I’ve ever heard (second only to PDSes of the RPGs - even though I actually rate P:T as a slightly better game).
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BG2’s story actually annoyed the crap out of me. Apart from the fact that it’s long I really can’t see how its plot has won it anything but derision. The characters are all annoying as hell (well, the evil ones are bearable), the romances are atrocious, the plot could have come from any 50s B-movie (with a dash of modern soap) and the jokes are, if not ripped off, puerile and obvious. I can’t really say I’d miss any of the above, especially if my first point is right.
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Dungeons are dull. I prefer colourful scenery - the screenshots I’ve seen of ID seem to have much more outside combat than BG2.
So can anyone tell if I’m likely to be disappointed?
Gehpnaet - I really don’t know how to explain it in simpler terms. If it says “D&D” anywhere on the box, it’s a D&D game. If it doesn’t, it’s probably not.
I suppose the tricky part is that most D&D products are primarily labelled by their “campaign world” (i.e. Forgotten Realms, Planescape, Dragonlance, etc), but there should be a D&D logo or trademark somewhere on the box.
Er…what box? 
Hey!My cousin lent it to me!
Or anywhere. Like the title loop, title screen, etc.
How would you compare Gothic 3, to say, Oblivion, when it comes to story? Or, like Oblivion is it more about placing you in a big, immersive world with lots of quests to do, with the main story seeming more like an afterthought? Gothic 3 is one of the games I’ve been considering getting next time I upgrade my PC you see… (I’d have no hope in hell of running it smoothly on my current setup).
I beat WotES like yesterday. Great game despite it being a short RPG.
Only thing I didn’t like was that towards the end of the game, gold becomes worthless. Shame.
Now its time to play it again, only this time I’ll choose my characters and roll my stats till am satisfied with them.
Gothic 3 is currently plagued with various glitches and bugs which according to some are a big deal and according to others (including me) they don’t hinder the fun you get much.
Other than that I’ll say that the the game is both more suitable for sandbox gameplay and also has a better story than Oblivion. The whole setting is much more interesting even though it actually lacks in the available lore as far as I can see (you won’t find books and such all over the place as in Oblivion). It’s hand crafted and includes unique touches all over the place rather than generic terrain and structures that keep repeating. Also, you can shape the story depending on which faction you join rather than having only the choice of either doing the story or skipping it and going sandbox.
In the gameplay it reminds me of a MMORPG (or an old school RPG) as you don’t only have skills directly related to combat but you can also invest in things like alchemy (make potions, fire arrows, etc), smithing (make weapons) and hunting (get more from animals). The skill system is strict as you’ll need to spend “learning points” and gold for trainers to teach you even what are usually basic things like using shields.
I love the variety of the wildlife and how they have different states such as “aggressive” or “hungry” (it doesn’t apply on all though). Since they don’t all simply attack you on sight it doesn’t feel like you have to kill everything in your path. Seeing wolves in the distance attack other animals and then pretend they are eating over their corpse is neat… Animals also sleep like humans.
About the only thing the game lacks in compared to Oblivion (imo) is the random NPCs. In Oblivion many of them have a short backstory and such while in Gothic 3 you can only initiate dialogues with characters that actually have something to say. The rest are generic “rebels” “orcs” “slaves” or whatever faction they belong in and only say a phrase or two when you click on them.
Anyway, I cut this short because you didn’t ask for a detailed analysis or anything and it was a big rant in its previous form. I hope it’s a little bit easier to read now… Ask me about anything more you want to know.
Thanks for that Al3x. It sounds like decent game when taking the bugs out of the equation, and I don’t think they will as much of a problem by the time I get around to playing the game, as I’m not planning on upgrading until after Vista comes out.
Well, well, well… I was putting away a bunch of stuff in my computer room last night (recently moved, still haven’t completely unpacked) and what did I come across? A copy of Planescape: Torment that a coworker gave to me many moons ago that I somehow forgot about.
Looks like I’ve got some gaming to look forward to on my next business trip 
[quote=“Abadd”]Well, well, well… I was putting away a bunch of stuff in my computer room last night (recently moved, still haven’t completely unpacked) and what did I come across? A copy of Planescape: Torment that a coworker gave to me many moons ago that I somehow forgot about.
Looks like I’ve got some gaming to look forward to on my next business trip :)[/quote]
Planescape: Torment had an excellent story…but that’s it. The gameplay, and everything else, SUCKED. I, personally, do not know why so many people get tingly all over for this game…
Why? It uses the same combat system as Baldur’s Gate and KOTOR. I recall those games selling millions of copies.
All the game models were modelled in 3 dimensions and scaled into 2D, which helps them stand the test of time. I laughed at how the much newer Divine Divinity’s 2D models seemed wooden in comparison to the much older Planescape.
It’s a pity how Interplay ended. All the developers were hardcore gamers. But hey, at least Sega translated Planescape Torment into Japanese for more people to enjoy. The fact that Baldur’s Gate 3 was being made by the same behind behind Torment, only for it to never see the light of day because of a stupid liscensing dispute saddens me. Dark Alliance 3 suffered the same fate despite both previous games selling very well. Maybe the series was just cursed without BioWare!
You do realize that almost all of the old Black Isle guys have formed the company that is now known as Obsidian, right?
And that Sega announced a partnership with them? 
[quote=“Abadd”]You do realize that almost all of the old Black Isle guys have formed the company that is now known as Obsidian, right?
And that Sega announced a partnership with them? :D[/quote]
Yeah I know. I just liked how Interplay used to stand for something, then they went from one extreme to the other rather than anchor themselves in the middle, and lost their way.
And what do you think of Mr Billionaire Satomi’s approach to turning Sega around with his “dual-path” of expanding existing IPs while inventing new ones to set new trends? That’s standing for something.
The sheer imagination that goes into some games is just amazing (of course you know that better than anyone). The D&D brand has kind of lost that lately. Interplay and BioWare knew were to take it, while Atari has undeniably struggled (that’s lost revenue as well if you want to look at it purely in terms of profits since the D&D brand still has a lot of selling power).
I need to check out Neverwinter Nights 2.
Funny thing that I realized. A lot of people recognize Sega for its strong IP. Thing is, Sega became most famous when it was creating new IP. Sega’s track record with sequels has been very spotty. So, the fact that Sega is moving away from simply regurgitating old IP and trying new routes is definitely encouraging.
I agree and disagree. In regards to their craptacular series like Sonic the Hedgehog, Super Monkey Ball, and all that other rubbish like the new Shining Force series - they just need to forget about them and move on. The series which DO have imagination (cough Panzer Dragoon *) need to be continued at all costs.
Even if those “costs” included pushing out a sequel that lacked that imagination?
See PSU for a perfect example of that, I’m increasingly sad to say…
Kadamose - The main point of my post was that in general, Sega’s best games are there first installments of each. However, there have been exceptions (Panzer, Shining Force, Phantasy Star, etc). But, given that the people who created the best versions of those games are either no longer at the company, were created by entirely different companies, or are simply no longer in a position where they are actively creating new games, it’s hard to guarantee that the quality of a sequel to any of those would live up to the legends that they have created. Especially when considering that gamers have built up the games in their minds to epic proportions…
Hmm… that’s true of almost all sequels, though. On initial reflection, I’d say that Sega have produced some of the more worthy sequels in their time (MD Sonics, Virtua Fighter series as well as the ones you mentioned). But tonnes of crap, admittedly.
Still, it’d be interesting to see Eternal Champions 2