Let me rephrase one of the points in my previous post Geoffrey. I had said Bioware wouldn’t have made BG if they hadn’t found a publisher. Now, do you think the game would have been created if it wasn’t a “risk” (again in their opinion) but if it was CERTAIN to FAIL?
By the way since we are talking about ppl leaving Sega, the Rez developer left Sega and will create Rez 2 for the Nintendo DS and/or the PSP though it won’t be named Rez 2 because Sega owns the rights. He left and created his own company supposdelly cos of the “fear of the new” game companies AND Sega itself have. How can he claim that when Sega gave him the green light for Rez’s development on first place? Again, we can’t expect from Sega to keep doing releases like PDO that are not just a risk but do not sell good for sure even tho they are amazing in their own right. He’s got all my respect for creating Rez but Rez wouldn’t have had the chance to be created if he was in any other company imo… Sega was the reason he was able to realise that dream and what he does is leave Sega and say those things to the press. That sounds like advertising of the kind “buy my next game, I’m poor and I just want to make good games and Sega didn’t let me so I will do what’s right and make them for you anyway!”
Actually, the Sammy/Sega merger is something that should be feared. Sega has slowly shown that it’s losing its focus on innovation, and instead, following the ways of profitability like Sony and Nintendo - which neither of those companies innovate, they just take a used and abused system and keep using it because the masses ARE stupid and will continue to buy them.
When the merger situation was going a year and a half ago, I was hoping that the Namco/Sega merger would have went well without a hitch. So were the Sega developers…they absolutely loved the idea of working with the Namco development team and toolsets. Sadly, that didn’t happen.
Though it should be noted that, in the beginning, Sega was VERY against merging with Sammy, and the first deal was turned down. After the Namco deal was turned down, as well…out of desperation, Sega took up Sammy’s offer and merged with them (which Sammy now owns a 51% share in Sega).
Panzer Dragoon Orta has been the only good thing that has come from Sega in the past 2 years - of course, many would argue that Phantasy Star Online Episodes 1-3 are good too…but I don’t find that to be the case…at all.
The Dreamcast’s lack of popularity in Japan killed the Dreamcast. It was quite successful in America and Europe and Sega made a huge mistake by giving up at the first hurdle. If Sega wasn’t strapped with the financial losses of previous consoles I dare say the Dreamcast wouldn’t have died so soon.
I don’t blame Camelot for walking away from Sega after Sega turned its back on the conscientious developer. Camelot even regretted Sega’s decision not to translate Shining Force 3 in its entirety. Sega betrayed its fans before falling out with Camelot.
I wonder how good Golden Sun 3 for the GameCube will be.
Baldur’s Gate was a risk because Interplay didn’t know if it would sell an adequate amount of copies or not. Developers and publishers now are far more inclined to develop games they know will sell. This doesn’t bode well for the future of the games industry.
I guess Virtua Fighter 4, Shinobi and Virtual On Marz don’t work for you either Kadamose?
And as far as I know (Haven’t looked into it recently) Sammy owned 22% but that gives them controlling stake(sp) cos it’s the majority still even tho not a real big % at all…
And Sammy isn’t all bad, they have created some good side scrolling shooters. Hardly a mainstream thing as well. What’s bad is Sammy wants Sega to focus on the arcade market cos they have higher profit there than the console market. Still, Sega spokespersons have said that will NOT happen.
I think most devlopers like making games. It is way too difficult field (looooooooong hours) to work in if you don’t love it.
So it isn’t so much developers make games for money, but the game you make has to generate enough return than it costs to make it, otherwise you cannot have a business, you cannot pay the people, building, and other misc costs behind making the game.
Sometimes a game will come out at a loss in hopes the sequel will sell better (and the costs of the first game are leveraged on the sequel) or something, but except for a few isolated instances, a game has to make the money it costs or it isn’t viable to do any more. Sega (and other companies) aren’t ‘Non-Profit’ groups, their artists and programmers aren’t working for a charity.
If Panzer continually does not make enough money to cover costs, it is not a viable IP that is worth developing for.
Also, as a side note- When a lot of companies like Camelot or Treasure spin off, it is for creative differences, but also in thought with that is their ideas will generate more fans, which is more money. You could argue with a publisher that what the publisher wants to do is not what fans really want, so in a way you are saying you want to spin off because your ideas would be more profittable than theirs. The guys at REZ may feel, “If we spin off and do what we really want to, without being held back by a big company, we can make these games and stay in buisness” . But they still have to stay in buisness. It may mena less staff, cutting back on dev systmes, building costs, salaries, whatever, but they still have to make games that cover their costs.
Yes SEGA would still be in the Console Hardware business.
SEGA make 2 big mess ups. 1 Letting SOA make that pice of cr*p the 32X.
And 2nd. Not getting Square Soft to make Saturn games (when they had the chance).
[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Yes SEGA would still be in the Console Hardware business.
SEGA make 2 big mess ups. 1 Letting SOA make that pice of cr*p the 32X.
And 2nd. Not getting Square Soft to make Saturn games (when they had the chance).
The Saturn was killing the PS in JP untill FF7.[/quote]
Ha, if Squaresoft ever became a Sega developer, I would probably no longer be a Sega fan. I hate Square-Enix THAT much.
[quote=“Team Andromeda”]Yes SEGA would still be in the Console Hardware business.
SEGA make 2 big mess ups. 1 Letting SOA make that pice of cr*p the 32X.
And 2nd. Not getting Square Soft to make Saturn games (when they had the chance).
The Saturn was killing the PS in JP untill FF7.[/quote]
Ha, if Squaresoft ever became a Sega developer, I would probably no longer be a Sega fan. I hate Square-Enix THAT much.[/quote]
Tell me about it. I hate SS and EA. But you need the likes f them to make games on your console.
GameArts make the best RPG’s (not SS). Lunar on the Mega CD is still the best RPG ever made :).
[quote=“Team Andromeda”]
Tell me about it. I hate SS and EA. But you need the likes f them to make games on your console.
GameArts make the best RPG’s (not SS). Lunar on the Mega CD is still the best RPG ever made :).[/quote]
Lunar was great and all, but it’s nowhere near the greatest RPG ever. Did you know that Lunar was originally going to be for the Turbo Duo, and that there is a working demo of the game floating around?
Oh, and the greatest RPG of all time would definitely have to be Panzer Dragoon Saga. The second greatest RPG would definitely have to be Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys for the Turbo Duo.
[quote=“Team Andromeda”]
Tell me about it. I hate SS and EA. But you need the likes f them to make games on your console.
GameArts make the best RPG’s (not SS). Lunar on the Mega CD is still the best RPG ever made :).[/quote]
Lunar was great and all, but it’s nowhere near the greatest RPG ever. Did you know that Lunar was originally going to be for the Turbo Duo, and that there is a working demo of the game floating around?
Oh, and the greatest RPG of all time would definitely have to be Panzer Dragoon Saga. The second greatest RPG would definitely have to be Ys IV: The Dawn of Ys for the Turbo Duo.[/quote]
Nope .
Is that really true.
GameArts were massive SEGA fans, and only made ames for thier system back in the Mega Drive days.
I still say Lunar on the Mega CD (Saturn.PSX version were cr*p) is the best RPG I have ever played. SAGA is 2nd .
There’s no “greatest rpg” it’s all an opinion. Depends on what appeals to each person more. (Just wanna avoid this thread turning into an argument over what’s best…) I love PDS but I love Shining Force and I love Xenogears too (yeah Xenogears is a squaresoft game:) And there’s more. My favorite is PDS, someone else’s favorite might be another one, that’s all.
Is that really true.
GameArts were massive SEGA fans, and only made ames for thier system back in the Mega Drive days.
I still say Lunar on the Mega CD (Saturn.PSX version were cr*p) is the best RPG I have ever played. SAGA is 2nd .[/quote]
Actually, I’m wrong - Lunar wasn’t going to be released for the Turbo Duo. It was Silpheed that has a working demo for that system. Oh, and Gamearts did another game for the PC-88 called VEIGUS.
Is that really true.
GameArts were massive SEGA fans, and only made ames for thier system back in the Mega Drive days.
I still say Lunar on the Mega CD (Saturn.PSX version were cr*p) is the best RPG I have ever played. SAGA is 2nd .[/quote]
Actually, I’m wrong - Lunar wasn’t going to be released for the Turbo Duo. It was Silpheed that has a working demo for that system. Oh, and Gamearts did another game for the PC-88 called VEIGUS.[/quote]
That’s fair enough. Also GA did a Silpheed game for the PC.
My favorite rpg would have to be Panzer Dragoon Saga. It’s world is so unique and very mysterious at times. There are so many mysteries that need explinations. The game is very fun and the monsters are very original.
My second favorite rpg would have to be Skies of Arcadia. This game is also very unique and imaginative. The graphics in the towns and dungions are awesome. You also get a great scense of exploration not found in many games. The music is good as well. I am awaiting PDS 2 and SOA 2. Bring them on baby!
For me, as a player, it was a good move. Though I still didn’t have it (soon, soon…) I love shooters and they now are almost dead (and to think that some time ago they ruled the earth shrugs)
If it was a good move in the business sense: Yes.
A shooter is much less expensive than an RPG, it helped with brand recognition because it was lauded as one of the best games of all times and hardcore players loved it.
The sales are not that good but I doubt they lost money with it. Xbox is not that huge blockbuster of a console so I think they used the right amount of risk taking and revived one of the greatest game series of all time.