I’m not saying what I think he says is the absolute truth, just that it would make sense if the soul he’s referring to is in fact the Heresy program.
[quote=“Heretic Agnostic”]The second “dragon” is a data record of the anomalous genetic profile that Lagi’s origin represents, perhaps after the imperial Tower changed it’s activity the Dragon, sensing opportunity, split it’s energy in that moment and reanimated the dormant Blue Dragon to deal with the situation.
Then the original body having been destroyed in the Tower’s destruction it found a new host somehow, perhaps that host was part of the existing seed of the Light Wing and in merging with it the dragon soul(s) had to abandon most of it’s own genetic programing in an attempt to avoid overpowering and irreparably contaminating the incomplete Light Wing code.[/quote]
It seems I’m not the only one making assumptions here
I never said there weren’t any other options, I’m only saying that the Different Dragons theory seems to be the most consistent explanation to me.
In the end I would be satisfied to know if there’s even a straight answer for all these questions.I wouldn’t mind not knowing what it was;just wanted to know it existed.
Any theory will contain assumptions and conjecture, there’s a difference between that and arguing that one theory is the most valid based on unquestioned other assumptions.
Which is after all where this began in your decision to speciously impugn my own challenge and questioning of said assumptions, and my assertion that the different dragons theory is not the exlusively sensible one.
[quote=“Al3xand3r”]Eh, no, the Sky Rider is certainly not Lundi that much is certain…
The deal with Edge is also arguable, we can only guess what happened to him. Most people seem to agree on the version mentioned but we really can’t know for sure.
Oh and there’s always the possibility that the baby dragon / Solo Wing quests in Saga were easter eggs for the fans rather than parts of the storyline. There’s a few people who believe that (myself included)…
But man these things have been dicussed extensively in the past, I think we all agreed to disagree in the end as nothing can be proven…[/quote]
No what? Since you added bold tags to the Sky Rider / Lundi part I’ll assume you mean it’s not certain that he is not Lundi… And I’ll respond with this.
That was a response to an old thread you had started even as seen here. As for the rest of the post, they are just opinions and they can’t be proven wrong, or even right.
Regarding the baby dragon in PDS, it’s possible that this dragon was meant to be the son of Lagi, an asexually created clone left behind in the crest based 100% on Lagi’s DNA. In one of the campsites, Edge even asks “Is he the son of my dragon?”
If that were the case, in a sense, the pup would be Lagi biologically, just not the same creature mentally as Lagi.
I notice that I failed to respond to the most interesting thing you said D-Unit…
My answers will be more questions, the first: If the dragon that is “stored” in Shelcoof is Lagi, then why isn’t it in the same form as Lagi was at the end of Zwei? Surely the idea that it’s a copy or clone makes at least as much sense as the idea that it’s actually Lagi’s body?
My second answer is that if we’re getting all literal like that then why is the second crest also not “empty” and why would that crest be necessary to mash the two dragons together? For that matter why would it even matter that two bodies merge when the two souls had already been merged from “birth”? What do bodies really matter at all when no matter how it’s looked at neither entity seems to require contiguousness of corporeal form?
One way or another the Dragon Crest represents a mechanism that has stored a primordial version of Lagi in that case. Neither can the design be seen as proof of what’s in it since what came out was not the same as the design, and every known crest has the same design anyway. All of this seems to rest on the idea that the Dragon Crest is where the body was “discarded” to, which also cannot be proven unequivocally.
I didn’t mean to ignore the question but specious connections tend to make me see red, and I was preoccupied with your lead argument about Lundi not knowing about the existence of the Heresy Program. Which is plainly immaterial when by the same token he also wouldn’t know if there was a separation of the souls, so how can it be assumed that he’s talking about only one or the other?
I don’t know how the crests work so I can’t answer that question without making more assumptions. We only know for a fact that Lagi went in the crest and a dragon pup very similar to his original form came out. To answer with more questions: if the dragon in PD 1 is Lagi, then why did the Solo Wing from PD 1 not appear as a mutated coolia in PD Saga (even though the logical answer is that Edge wouldn’t be flying anywhere with a dragon pup, but anyway…)?
My theory: because it opened up two paths of evolution which one dragon (one body) couldn’t follow otherwise.
If I remember correctly the dragon crest always takes the shape of the dragon that entered it originally, as we see in the different endings of PD Zwei.
Just about everything we know about PD can’t be proven unequivocally. It can’t be unequivocally proven that the Sky Rider is a Drone, even though there are a lot of reasons to assume that he is. Lundi looked at the crest and called it “Lagi” and the crest design also took the physical shape of the dragon so I’m not sure what reason there is to think the body was discarded somewhere else.
I’m not assuming that he was talking about one or the other, I’m assuming he was talking about both and didn’t realize that there was a difference. Again:
“I have no idea why my friend had such a humble beginning.”
If he knew about the Heresy Program escaping Sestren and entering the Coolia, then why would he say this? My conclusion: he didn’t know about the Program, only the dragon itself. Every time he speaks about the dragon who is meant to destroy the Towers, this is clearly something the Heresy Program was designed to do, not “Lagi”. That’s why I can only conclude that he’s talking about the Heresy Program since we have already seen that entity “travel” around. What reason is there to think that it would take Lagi’s soul with him?
You’re still just not getting it. You were using the exact same factor to justify your interpretation as you were to impugn my interpretation. NEITHER OF US CAN KNOW WHAT LUNDI REALLY MEANS!
I tried to point out that Lundi doesn’t know about the “Heresy Program” as such precisely because my point there is essentially just as specious, it’s semantics and I was hoping you’d take the hint and realize that the entire avenue of argument doesn’t mean anything. You’re effectivley throwing the baby out with the bathwater. (I’m kind of grasping at as many metaphors as I can I know, hopefully one will mean something?)
You say it yourself, he didn’t know about the program only “The Dragon”. So it’s entirely your interpretation that he means the Heresey Program, your argument is anchored on a concept of the Heresy Program that is conjecture. And I actually have no problem with that, it’s you that had the problem with the alternate conjecture inherrent to my interpretation, or seemed to in your rush to set it up as meaningless. It’s all just interpretation, right?
I actually can’t quite make sense of what you’re asking, so I’m going to have to try to deconstruct why it is that you think the Solo Wing would be in the form of a mutated coolia if PD1’s dragon was Lagi. The only thing I can figure is that you’re basing it on the idea that because of the “Dragon Pup” that emerges from the crest is in that form it means that if that’s not Lagi then the other crest would have Lagi and it must look the same?
If that’s the case you would be doing the same thing to me again and arguing an assumption that hides another assumption. But I honestly don’t know what you’re asking anyway.
The endings that never happened? - But ok, I’ve always thought it’s telling that the crest looks very different in every other ending, the “lesser” dragon images all look sort of overlayed and grafted into the crest compared to the “Solo Wing” image which fits into it like it was made to. Exactly what that means is up for interpretation but I guess your interpratation is that there’ve been a lot of different Blue Dragon incarnations?
I don’t require unequivocal proof by the way, I’m essentially trying to hold up a mirror to how uncompromising your interpratation comes across if you call another interpretation a failure on the basis that it fails to conform to the assumptions your own interpretation makes.
What? I offered my interpretation of the Different Dragon theory, you said “Lundi basically tells us that it IS the same dragon” to which I replied with a possible explanation for that fact. I was defending my point of view, not trying to make other interpretations sound meaningless (and if you got that impression it was not my intention).
Where did I call any other interpretation a failure? I don’t know where you’re getting this from. What I do know is that there’s not much point in continuing this debate since it’s going around in circles anyway.
OK, I’ll admit that I carried some things into this from the last time I argued about it. For one thing I initially had no idea that you thought the crest was the body as well since it’s not part of Lance Way’s submitted version of the theory. One note on that and an additional answer to your first question, you may recall that we (somehow) carry the actual Dragon Crest with us to the ruins where the Solo Wing transformation takes place, and it looks complete after being placed in the second ‘terminal’ thing.
As for this going around in circles I completely agree, I have said before that I’ve never believed there’s enough information to resolve the issue anyway. My need to argue about it started with this:
Because since that was the lead point of your “defense” it implies that you think it negates the relevance of my references. It was specious (and thus obnixious to me) because the point itself is obviously true but you dont actually argue for how it affects my references. In other words what difference does it actually make whether Lundi knows the details about the Heresy Program?
What he does know is that his dragon entered a deep sleep, and he tells us that* his dragon* has returned with a new body. It’s precisely because he may not know about the Heresy Program that we have just as much reason to believe he’s talking about Lagi, who is after all his dragon.
Ehh, maybe I should have just responded with “but what?” and left it at that… shrug
- But ok, I’ve always thought it’s telling that the crest looks very different in every other ending, the “lesser” dragon images all look sort of overlayed and grafted into the crest compared to the “Solo Wing” image which fits into it like it was made to. Exactly what that means is up for interpretation but I guess your interpratation is that there’ve been a lot of different Blue Dragon incarnations?