Has Anyone Ever Considered Resurrecting This Awesome Series?

Panzer Dragoon
1

Like… Seriously?

I’m not talking about pipe dreams like “I wish SOMEONE ELSE would remake the Panzer Dragoon games”, I mean has anyone actually made a concertive effort?

Hi guys, new the forums, however, I have visited the site for many years and think it’s great - I’m in love with this series. The characters, the story and especially the setting. Panzer Dragoon really does hold some of my fondest memories of gaming and of being a child and getting swept away by this epic saga.

And this is my point. I want it remade. Sega have all but abandoned the series (as well as many of their other awesome franchises) and they are all the worse for it. The company is barely recognisable to how it was 15 or 16 years ago.

These games seem to have a thriving fan community. Couldn’t we all pull together and maybe do a kickstarter project, donate to it ourselves, try and acquire the rights and set about remaking these ingenious games? I’m sure there are some talented programmers out there in the fan base who would contribute for the love of the series.

Tell me, am I being ridiculously silly? Or are we all happy to let this saga fade into obscurity?

2

You’d need to acquire the rights first before attempting crowdfunding. That alone would prove to be huge challenge. I think you’d be better off making your own game inspired by Panzer Dragoon.

There were some fans here attempting to make a new Panzer Dragoon game (or heavily inspired). I don’t know if that project is still going ahead though.

3

True, true. But as Panzer Dragoon is an old franchise and could be considered as “abandoned” I don’t think the rights would be a huge amount. Certainly not in the millions, more than likely in the hundreds of thousands. Still, it depends on how many fans are out there and how much they would donate to securing rights. Probably wouldn’t be anywhere near enough, but hey ho, it’s a hopeful thought.

4

If you can find out how much Sega would sell the IP for, I’m sure fans would be interested to know. We could gauge how likely purchasing them would be from there.

But, if you’re going to go to extent of paying hundreds of thousands, why not make your own similar game instead? You could do it with a lot less money. If you have the skills, you can do a lot with Unity, Kickstarter, Steam, etc with significantly less initial capital.

5

Totally agree with you about a game influenced by this series, but…

…It wouldn’t be Panzer Dragoon…

As a fan, like me, I know you’d feel the same way about that.

And yes, I know there are plenty of tools out there for indie developers these days. It’s much easier than it used to be. Unfortunately though, my skills are more towards artwork, concepts and writing / story development, I have basic experience with Unity etc. but certainly not enough to create anything similar to Panzer. There has to some programmers who are PD fans.

6

I understand. I’d love to see a new Panzer game, or an older one revisited. These days I try to concentrate on achievable goals to avoid wasted time and effort. Given how much work is involved in creating games, any serious attempt to make a game (Panzer or otherwise) should come with a solid strategy.

I’m a programmer (web, not games though), so I could probably learn Unity if I wanted to. Time is a serious constraint for me though.

7

Yes and I’m guessing you put a lot into this site and if so, fair play, it’s great!

I’m going to look further into this and see just how realistic it would be. Probably not very realistic at all, but it will be interesting nonetheless.

8

Thanks. It’s a lot easier when you do it gradually over time and get feedback as you go, an article here, and new piece of fan art here. Version 4 (the current one) took a long time to release because we redesigned, reorganised, and proof read everything to ensure quality (the site was quite a mess before version 4). Most of content is added piecemeal so the required effort isn’t so big.

Games development is a lot tougher because you might go months or years without releasing anything. If you lose motivation half way through you have nothing to show for all your hard work. For me, creating a game would have to be something I was really motivated to do (or would allow me to make a guaranteed living doing it at the same time). I have similar thoughts about writing a PhD. As a writer, I’m competent enough, but do I have the motivation to spend the required time and effort? I see making a Panzer Dragoon style game as a similar level of commitment.

Sounds good.

9

Well I’ve contacted Sega, no response as yet. I haven’t mentioned anything about PD, just a query on what their policy is on purchasing game rights and whether it’s feasible.

10

Hey my bad, that dissenting vote was me. It’s not quite how I feel but out of the options you have it’s the closest to my honest response. The issue is that all the core Panzer Dragoon games - yes including Orta - are truly phenomenal* for their time.*. Azel in particular could never have the same impact as a remake without a AAA budget, and that’s still just hypothetical. Subjectively the games are as close to perfect as they’ll ever get, so yes that is my feeling.

But that is not to say I think remakes would be a bad thing, just irrelevant to me personally.

11

What about a fan game, or a fan HD reboot, like Zwei revamped to current tecnology as a community project?

I’ve been willing to work as an artist in a PD project since forever…

12

[quote=“The Ancient”]Hey my bad, that dissenting vote was me. It’s not quite how I feel but out of the options you have it’s the closest to my honest response. The issue is that all the core Panzer Dragoon games - yes including Orta - are truly phenomenal* for their time.*. Azel in particular could never have the same impact as a remake without a AAA budget, and that’s still just hypothetical. Subjectively the games are as close to perfect as they’ll ever get, so yes that is my feeling.

But that is not to say I think remakes would be a bad thing, just irrelevant to me personally.[/quote]

I hear ya buddy, which is why I included the poll option you selected. The games are perfect, there’s absolutely nothing wrong with them in themselves and do not need a remake from a gameplay perspective (or even graphics for that matter).

The problem is that technology has moved on. I don’t have a Sega Saturn. I don’t have an original Xbox. Even though I have an original copy of Saga myself, it is considerably hard to get hold of, not only because of scarcity, but also price. I did own both of those consoles at the time they were released, but sold them on as new generations came out. Even if I kept them I wouldn’t be able to hook them up to my TV as it doesn’t have any scart inputs.

To put it bluntly, I don’t have any way of playing these games ever again. A remake would solve that and please a hell of a lot of people in the process. Plus it would open doors for creating new entries in the series. And who DOESN’T want to see a completely new Panzer game?

13

Have you tried the SSF emulator? It’s quite good. Some info about it here: segaretro.org/SSF

Many of the screenshots on TWOTA were taken with SSF.

14

I’m going to say that ‘no, Panzer Dragoon shouldn’t be resurrected.’

My opinion is based on having recently watched a video regarding Silent Hill, another franchise which I loved and adored.

The video, which is quite interesting and funny, is here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v= re-release of the games, like a port with higher res graphics, like that seen on an emulator, with the typical art gallery, insider documentaries and write ups from the makers included, is all I would wish for.

There’s media that I love and have affected me on a personal level. Like the film ‘Fight Club’. I watched that film to death, to the point where it’s affected the way I live and think (my opinions on corporations and the meaning of money was substantially affected by this film), and yet I haven’t watched the film in years because key scenes and it’s morals are within me always, and I remember the film so vividly that I don’t really need to see them again. Incidentally, there’s a sequel being published in comic book form and I have mixed feelings if there’s any good reason other than money to do so.

Panzer Dragoon was the first Sega Saturn game I ever played, and I have strong personal emotions with just about all of the games, but I find it hard to believe that a new game could repeat performance, because I will be experiencing them at a different time period, when I’m a different person, and a future sequel would very unlikely touch me the same way the past games have.

If the original creators woke up one morning and said “hey, I have an idea for a sequel that would touch gamers on a personal level; just as much as the previous games.” then, sure, I’d be down with them making a sequel in the trust that it was being made for the right reason.

But to make a sequel because fans want to see barely anything more than a graphical update, or just to desperately imitate past experiences? Sounds like a game being made for all the wrong reasons.

Panzer Dragoon was concluded with the 3rd game, and the 4th one was a welcome edition which nailed the controls, showed us a PD with great graphics, and some awesome music. Even the original creators of PD have moved onto other projects and I’m sure they don’t care for franchise even as much as we do. They are proud of their work, but they’re different people now and they want to do different things with their professional lives than just try to resurrect a dead horse from the long past.

And we have Crimson Dragon to show us basically what a new PD would be like and, sure, Crimson has flaws due to the force of kinect, 180 turn to controls, and port to a new console, with a change to the soundtrack, but I’m sure that even if the game were made with the intention of being a 360 game with gamepad controls as its main focus from the start, it still wouldn’t have met our expectations. We would either criticise it as an imitator of PD, or complain it wasn’t close enough to the original material. And if they made it a PD sequel, I’m sure we’d all be complaining about it in some way because it didn’t feel the same as when we were play the saturn games.

Finally, regarding wanting to make your own PD… even if you miraculously owned the rights and made a game, it’s still just going to be a fangame. HELL, some people don’t consider Orta cannon just because some of the original staff weren’t on board when making it. What makes you think that making the game as a lucky fan is going to be accepted by the few people who still like and remember the franchise?

You’re not the original creators of the series, and even if you have in-depth knowledge of the series, no matter how you approach it, you’ll be approaching it as a fan, and not from an artistic point of view that the original creators intended. I think this is a losing battle, even if you overcame all the odds in your favour. Like I mentioned to begin with, the only thing it would prove was an unhealthy obsessiveness to a few video games.

Sorry to sound harsh. It’s not my intention to sound rude or vicious (if my post happens to read that way at any point). I just think that any such efforts are fruitless. Like Silent Hill and Fight Club, Panzer Dragoon is a series just best left in the past.

Also sorry for going on a long tangent here, but I hope people (the 1.5 people who probably read this post) will appreciate what I’m trying to say; lets move on guys. We’ve got this site in memory of these awesome games; 4 (or technically 5) of them. I think that’s enough.

15

Konami did screw up the HD versions of SH2 and 3. They obviously aimed for a quick conversion of those games and screwed up in the process.

I can forgive that because we still have the originals. What I can’t forgive is dumbing down a story in order to reach a wider audience. You can argue whether this happened to SH or not but you can’t deny that the games have changed. For better or for worse.

If Sega ever did make another Panzer Dragoon game I would want it to be a serious game and respect the source material. Neither of those things would happen if a new PD game was made today. They’d rewrite the story to suit a modern audience. If you look at WoW and Warcraft for example, the devs rewrote the lore constantly in order to keep it relevant to a modern audience.

I shudder to think how Blizzard will write Sargeras now. They will turn him into a one dimensional villain rather than a good person who realised that all the evil in the universe was indirectly created by his own people.

WoW and the Warcraft movie are held back by political correctness.

It’s enough to drive anyone mad. You have to respect the PD Orta devs because they stayed true to the source material.

16

Terramax,

I agree with you on the Fangame subject. As you said, a fangame, as the name sais, will always be a fangame, but I don’t see anything wrong with it.

But on your take on why this series shouldn’t be revived, I’ll have to completely disagree.
Nintendo is the living proof old games can and should be revived and or updated as gaming evolves, while still maintaining the soul and essence of the original game.

Also, no need for the original developers here, probably for the best. You’re right, they moved on, but even Orta wasn’t made by the same developers. That’s how it works. you need fresh ideas and renewed energy when the original developers can’t do it anymore. Once again, the new Zelda, coming to Wii U.

I don’t see any reason why it shouldn’t be made. Just because we have such great memories of the old ones? That will always be there, we have if for granted, even if a new release turns out to be bad. It would be a win/win situation because the old ones never change.

So yes, games that are distinct in their nature(category where PD fits) should be updated and revamped.

If Hideo Kojima had your had your mindset about this(leave it in the past), he would have never revived Metal Gear from the NES and made Metal Gear Solid for PSX after all those years.

17

MGS was never fully realised on the NES. Plus few people can say no to being rich.

If Sega made a new Panzer Dragoon they would have to remake it because few people played the original games and even fewer people remember them, then they would have to reflect a modern audience. And even then another IP would probably be a better investment.

Like I said, I wouldn’t trust anyone to make a new PD game unless they respected the source material and didn’t dumb it down. It might actually happen eventually, but only if the costs of making games goes down significantly. We might even be alive to see that. >:)

I don’t want to see this series destroyed by political correctness and people who have short attention spans. That’s what would happen.

PD has a lot of potential but it would need to be taken seriously for anyone to truly take it forward. Shining Force was taken in a “bold new direction” and I really don’t want PD to share the same fate. I doubt it’s popular enough anyway.

18

There’s always the risk of a continuation of the series being “less” than the originals - in Panzer Dragoon’s case, this is particularly likely due to the quality of Saga. I don’t want to see the same thing happen to Panzer that happened to Shining Force.

However, it could go the other way. Earlier this year I decided to sit down and watch the Batman films - all of them, including the 1966 film. The Nolan films, although newer and from a different director, IMO are considerably better than the films that came before The Dark Knight trilogy. It’s just Batman, but it could be argued that Panzer Dragoon began with similar simple origins (look at the original game’s story, it could have been a comic book). My point is that if Panzer Dragoon was reenvisioned by someone else, it wouldn’t necessarily mean that the quality could not be high or even improve on the originals.

19

How did you manage to endure the Batman and Robin film? >:)

Nolan’s films portrayed the League of Shadows well, especially how 100% loyal the League’s soldiers were.

If PD was ever remade or updated I want it to stay true to the original story and dark themes. That simply wouldn’t happen today if it had a large budget and was marketable IMO. Batman is so popular that it’s guaranteed success unless someone really screws up.

20

With difficulty. I somehow endured the whole film. :anjou_embarassed:

I think if it had the right director and publisher it could stay true to the dark themes of the Saturn trilogy. There would no doubt be some modernisation - the gameplay would need to change, real time gameplay rather than the turn based battles of Saga for example, but I don’t see why it couldn’t retain a similar art style, mature story and themes, etc. I used the Batman example because Nolan’s trilogy is a mature realisation of that IP. You’re right though that Panzer Dragoon is significantly less popular of course, so it would require a publisher ready to take a risk.